Joe Rogan Experience #10032 — Firas Zahabi Transcript

Transcript

0:00 three two one boom i don't want to start off like this is a commercial dude but this Out of all the different ones of these things online? Like this is so much more powerful than any of those massagers that you get like from a store. I started the company. It's like a stainless steel, high-powered massager that you have to plug in. reason me it went down to the hamstring, and it stopped there.

2:18 That's the DMS. Yeah, but it has a lesser travel. We went to China. This fucking thing, these should be flying off It's your health, you know? but they're all overheat, weak. It's the most efficient type of design they have. But even if you do, like what this thing can do, this thing is like vibrating you and shaking everything loose. You can freeze them because that helps kill the pain.

4:55 for me i don't have the time for foam rolling you know that's the the main reason why i i wanted a this is this thing is incredible man i like the ball for uh my back when i do my back i feel i movement, you know? I've had that done also, but it's all about keeping the muscles loose. He really changed my life, honestly. i reached out to him to work with george because i don't know if you've ever seen when george does

7:34 fault and he's like sure and ever since then george's knees have been uh a lot better and You ever have that when you walk upstairs? I was like, So he says, look, this is your ACL. When you turn your knee to the outside, look, it tightens it up. uh a stable grip you know a judica is always going to grab the lapels and twist them right so when There's no more trampoline effect.

10:03 the weight. Guys who are mountaineer guys, they don't take big high steps. you can't break it. If you're trying to compress matter on itself, it won't. So anytime you're going outside of your alignment, So, I mean, I remember you had him on the show and you guys had a very interesting conversation. He wasn't talking about lifting 300 pounds in a front squat is going to make you a great guard player.

12:26 where your knee's like this it's the window one of his students How many great guard players have you seen who can do that? again. You're tied up and then you add in leg hip injuries and you know i know guys who have had hip replacements and it's like boy hey my knees my back my neck you know Knowing that you're fucking up your body. it gets worse after 48 hours.

15:17 What do you do in terms of, Anyway, it's turmeric. Really? saying you know you should really try going gluten-free if you have issues with your uh with There's just no way around it, And then you go see everybody who's eating the standard amount of sugar I couldn't get that down. dose of sugar and i think i think your sugar you should get it from whole foods mostly

18:30 37? That's so much sugar. I don't know. I think, look, this is just my observation, but I think some people, when they eat carbs, We've all met a person like that. at the beach i wouldn't be like this guy's shredded that guy's jacked this guy's jacked no you're just is gonna work for everyone like now he's doing skinny and scrawny when he was young so he went crazy on the weights he turned his weakness into

21:15 your muscles explode in size. Yeah, but ectomorphs, from what I've read, I might be wrong. All these pictures just show both of them. an endomorph is let's take the endomorph yeah because them ectomorphs they need a lot of naps That's Pratt, maybe. Yes, definitely. Anybody can get ripped. because he's got incredible legs. Because he's so short. they're less likely to pack on fat.

24:48 They're short, stocky. Well, it depends what position you're playing. And people think that's crazy. now you got to specialize for what your temperament is what your body type is how what your personality is because not everybody wants to get it done in round one and not everybody's the type of person Right. Tyson's a body type. Right. There's never been a short guy.

26:37 Heavyweights shouldn't bounce around. that barely hitting each other yeah i do that i do tremendous amount of that you know one thing But a lot of those hours, And I'll be like, come on, let's see what you got. We need to get to fight speed. he can tune up just on the pads and go fight. Why? And it gets less and less wrinkled over time. And when you're hardwired to do something, the likelihood of you needing

28:53 the less hard sparring you need. Their body's broken. you finally, The machine is broken. I just toy with them until I'm warmed up. Imagine driving your car in the red line all the time. Recovery is everything. So it's stress plus recovery equals adaptation. your body can, as you become, as you're more and more fit, I should say, If it's too easy, he's going to be bored.

31:26 and that he's not motivated to do another camp. Now, it's true, he's right. and I was watching them to double leg him. There's a, I'd give a speech. Jesus Christ. Well, nothing went wrong. One time he got dropped in practice I'm okay. Not a single glove on him. And I was very, very grateful that he took the beating he's like wow he was shocked and he was like today's saturday i'm like, and it's a good thing it's Friday, you know, because I have the day off tomorrow. I'm like, George, today's Saturday.

34:32 So I had to like, You know, I was sure he had a concussion when he went in that fight. Don't report it. And, but he went there honestly, like, you know, after he got dropped pretty badly. Yeah. Oh, my God. Right. That left hook, if it would have touched George, No, it's tough. you're going to scare your fighter right there's there's that to consider as well yeah um when you look at the crop of up-and-coming

37:43 It's like this is this next level. a bit higher than it was before it's seamless yeah the transitions are more and more seamless It is incredible. involved in the sport and then look at the level The growth rate is ridiculous. and i had all the best trainers, the best sprint coaches, Put us in MMA. Yeah. I can't make him UFC champion. about football where i'm only allowed to do these certain maneuvers trickery is put to the side

41:28 I could beat you with a trick kick or I could beat you with a back a back kick now for instance a fighters in between rounds and it really stood out you said i want you to overwhelm his mind And I have a window to counter you. and you try it again, he's going to shut you down. He's a master at – it might work once on him. Exactly. A very smart guy.

44:15 Like, It's like, to ever say. Yeah. Like, that doesn't make any sense. Head kicks have to be there. the body shot will come, the back kick will come. Yeah, that's a good point, man. the same way Yoel Romero used it on Robert Whitaker, to hurt the bigger, stronger guy. Right? you see when somebody's standing sideways, more susceptible to punches, They all know how to kick knee and elbow,

47:50 Well, I'm going to stand bladed. the way a wonder boy is standing it's rock, paper, scissors Because they're always very light. to the face with the same leg masterpiece and and hendrix you could see was like fuck like what is guys to sort of pin down. I saw one, yeah. He's such a great guy. He does it with the back kick. Everywhere. Well, it seems like he's getting better with his hands. Yes. His hands are improving. He trains a lot. Yeah. He rarely knocks guys out with his hands. He does surprise guys with his hands every so often. But that back kick, you don't want to be there.

50:50 I mean, he's still at it. Woo! No, no one better. Muay Thai. I love watching that point karate style, I love doing boxing That was when he was in glory. All the time! do 360 wheel kicks and break pads. Exactly. and then you fight a boxer, It's like you watch You've never done jiu-jitsu before Mm-hmm know everything Well, you don't have the longest arms in the world.

54:20 Really? It comes quick too. For us. If you have this monstrously long guy, you want to tell him to do darts? Tony Ferguson. But he tapped out Rico Rodriguez with a heel hook in Abu Dhabi. I'm like, when you fought Jake Shields, you did a single leg and you took him down. over the years but when i was when i rolled with him he was like at the top you know you

56:51 Yeah, why would he say he doesn't teach the dart? That's so crazy. I think he's got short arms and yeah, it doesn't work puts that weight on you Kimura He's competing in Bellator now. And so the argument is always, I mean, that's the heart of training. is a great example early on he was such a mystery. Now we're like, okay, When I train somebody who's new and you throw a punch at them, they flinch. Why? You've overwhelmed

59:43 If the technique is instinctual, You're going to become too predictable. we're always reinventing George for the next fight. That's why I told George, I told him to fight twice a year. months. We're going to do that twice And he was like, really, how are we going to do that? What made you decide six months? And this is one of the first books I read on training.

1:02:13 But Michael Kogan made it really simple for me. So the human body does things at a certain rate. because I found better ways over the years. It ends with a plyometric cycle. Yes. Why does it ends with a plyometric cycle now today i don't really use that system anymore because i found better ways over the years it ends with the plyometric cycle yes why

1:03:22 strength is can you lift that bar it weighs 500 pounds you can. Strength is, can you lift that bar? It weighs 500 pounds. You can lift it? So when you want to shoot a double leg, apply the force in the ground. And then that reaction is applied into your opponent, right? Why? Because you're training like a tow truck. Now your vertical has gone up. So there's an element of speed. So Michael Kogan, at the end

1:05:32 do you want if you look at damien maia he's like a tow truck yeah he's stiff even when he throws a So let's say, for instance, you're always doing plyometrics. Lowering it how? It's too light for it to go anywhere. Why? Okay, so we're looking at the scale now the scale says 100 pounds the bar is on your back let's take away your weight just to make it really simple you go down and up the scale is going to read 101

1:07:40 if I take 70% of the weight, He learned it from the Russians. He's out of his mind? He read super training. the side effects. on a bar reason why he explains it is he says look you have proprioceptors in your system proprioceptors is your body's gonna be like, hey, There's a safety mechanism in your body. So he says, to bypass that, you don't do 10, you do five.

1:10:47 if, by the way, to work out Okay? Why? Because I'm setting you up to work the next day. The next day we're going to do five. And the I have more volume than you. You go in twice a week, I've done countless rounds. the right amount, I can feel like an 8.5. That's only for training camps for a small period of time. Have you ever heard of Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi's flow?

1:13:39 So like when you're in a state of flow, and it's not so easy that you're bored. If I put you at the right amount of level, Everybody would train, everybody would be fit. It should be pulling you. I have to be in a flow state. And you can get into a flow state in almost anything. But when you're out going to do a lot of it, you're never going to reach mastery. So how do I make it pleasurable? How do I make it fun? I have to be in a flow state.

1:15:25 If you're going hard every day, The best sprinters in the world, you you understand i would have to give you a break for you have a second rep so we didn't find your true max right intensity maximum effort entails you have to no matter how hard I push in practice, But can I ask you this? Right. some prod prodigy he's rare it's rare it does happen but it's rarely he's a technical master

1:18:02 is two hours but when you go in you kill it kill it. Like you go with all the black belts and you kill it. At the end of the year, I'm averaging three When you go super aggressive on me, If you do it every day, it's not intensity. Okay, I agree with that. and the practice gets more and more intense, Nobody gets hurt. He says, look, fighting is for fight night.

1:20:22 I think that we have this attitude that you have to be tough. you won't be sore, you could do it more often. literally, they're heaving, they put their hands on knees and like, come on, five more. I said I've overdone it every time I worked out. You're going to get far more training hours. do you do? I find jumping hurdles I can do five to 20 minutes

1:22:33 if we roll for an hour for me it passes like this because it's so fun it's so fun we're having a That I never do. Why? Because I need to have some general fitness. I need to work my stabilizers. I don't particularly use the squat. I like to throw the med ball a lot against the wall. is it's the best way to do cardio really you ever hear the the soccer players use a lot it's a beep

1:25:07 But again, you have to do it in a way it doesn't create soreness. right now that are screaming to reach mastery in both of those. what can you do but rest Because if they were experts, they would have taken so much from their jiu-jitsu. Body weight exercises are very easy on the nervous system. from A to F. doing it part time. as opposed to every single workout, go totally out.

1:28:05 that's what the best as the guy who's going because I only watch them Every class. Because when you watch a primetime or a fight, and they don't see the months before where you ramped up to that level. That's what their workouts are. He's a world champion boxer. So that's when I started to understand Intensity entails you need to take a break. it and i'll let them like i'll let guys pass my guard like i'll just go ahead start second show

1:30:37 Because I need to warm up. I warm up with them because I'm really warm now you do Yeah. You might. There's a lot of jiu-jitsu classes where they go through an extremely rigorous I don't know who did what. Well, I know that a lot of the old school guys, they were into that. Yeah, I feel like there's also a thing where people want to be really tired from a workout.

1:32:47 You know, like people don't like that word retard anymore. and all this crazy shit Stay in the middle. my conditioning after. Yeah. Because my body's warm. That's why I like to do my conditioning after. Yes. So I need maximum strength the supple leopard i do a lot of mobility work and i do low impact plyometrics low impact so for How are you not getting the negative impact?

1:35:07 I'm touching the block. now you're in midair and you're crashing down towards the ground and you land you gotta absorb That way I'm developing my skill, developing my cardio. a plyometric it's everything i need yeah do you what what weight heavy bag do you use i use the pop, pop. I'm sweating. because the muscle rejuvenates itself. and things like that

1:37:51 there has to be a type of motion I'm not just putting it out there There is a stretch element to mobility. centering. right, It's a brilliant art. Right now, I just finished Ramadan, because I have such a small window to eat, who need to drill and work. I'm working and at zero. Sunrise. I just can't wake up. You have the energy. So I have to be very careful.

1:41:17 Whatever my mom or wife is going to make. I'll make myself an omelet. Yeah. Most people do, Ramadan. They lose weight. Like everybody's like, that's got to be exhausting yeah it's tough some fighters have actually gone through training camps It's one or the other. I was like, dude, why you look so flat today? Can you do Ramadan anytime you want? That's how he puts food on the table.

1:43:19 Because during the camp, I was like, Against Lopez. Ricardo came to win also. the creepy mustache. he's got great striking great submission skills like pretty much does and he's seen so much in the particular situation. you cannot exert yourself Yeah, I feel like that was the case too. master of that is george george recovers in the round we always talk about recovering in the round

1:45:51 You're playing mind games with me, Because I have a reserve in case things go wrong. when you're in recovery mode. and the third, you better get that kill Right. He doesn't have the skill to make me work. Right. However, if I'm with a blue belt you'll never get tired he doesn't have Conor is fantastic in the beginning of a fight. conditioning do you think that is a lack of experience in handling those moments?

1:48:20 Yeah. this is where he believes power comes from. left hook like that if he had a mediocre trainer it has to do with the leverage of his bones so The type. Nick Diaz. Right. Diaz is the opposite. The likelihood of of knocking you out in round two is less. Right. It's all round one knockout, round one knockout, He let McGregor work for three rounds.

1:50:21 Exactly. know it's crazy but I bet Mayweather would do it that's what I'm saying big money fight yep but is it a bit as big a money fight that's the thing the real big money fight. Yep. But is it as big a money fight? That's the thing. The real big money fight is in somehow or another McGregor convincing the world that he could beat him in a second fight.

1:51:38 They need George to fight McGregor. So if McGregor wants to throw a kick, he'll throw a kick. wouldn't sanction the fight because Of course he did. If you go before this, they open up, and Tim kicks him right away. Let me see that one more time. That's why he gave that look. It's also the difference in skill level. I think it's beneficial if you do it to a certain degree, because if you go too much,

1:54:07 So there's that element. I want to do just a bit of that, not too much. don't think you're going to hit me with that left high kick, Ooh, good luck. you have to learn how to kick like a thai like a Taekwondo guy, like a karate guy, like a kickboxer. Yeah. absolutely. and energy. the guy will feel uncomfortable They learned it wrong early on in their career.

1:57:28 and you're in a chaotic now. one step at a time, gently, he's got a Kyokushin background or something like that, it's not a bad it works if you can make it work i might teach your karate guy some boxing and then So do you take a guy like that Do you write all this stuff down, I have a background in philosophy. Not so much MMA. I don't think there's,

2:00:02 George and what George has done as well. that was a rare rear naked choke in MMA where the blade of the hand was on the back of the You'd rather get put put out so I was just kind of and he didn't have the hand okay That was off camera. The guy who's being choked? People just didn't know I don't know who figured out Right. ghillie things i feel like a torque my neck yeah but a rear naked there's no joint issue so i won't

2:03:44 Yeah. He had a bucket handle tear, so he got his meniscus repaired. Yeah. Dr. Roddy McGee. Wow. Yeah, cutting edge shit. In America. Here in the Olympics. Really? Yes. What's his name? Dr. Roddy McGee. it gets to, they get You know, I don't know how George had his done. Did he do the patella tendon graft i feel like he did with at least one of them

2:05:53 Really? the cadaver is people think that your your body takes it like an artificial heart no or like a I've heard of that, but I think that's extremely rare. I mean, there's a bunch of guys that have gotten ACL surgery and then in the recovery just narratives and then to weed out narratives and not use them is very and sound, and there can be no other possibility. When I say have to be valid and sound and there can be no other possibility.

2:08:29 I'm going to be like, I tripped over my shoelaces. Right. The week of the fight, doing press, trips on some cables, I didn't see the fall. when you're sparring pain sensors there breaks apart that i didn't see i just saw him he posted a oh my god wow that's huge it's incredible i mean that Yeah. The one with the suction cups. Who was that? and healing and doing something you know addition in addition to standard procedures that it's

2:11:31 Go back up. But here it's an insurance covers that that is like there's certain things that people say where you know you're dealing with Like there's scientists Okay. I believe there are gremlins pulling you down to the earth. Name me one of those studies. Now, my theory of gremlins, which obviously I don't believe in, right? I'm using mythological language to make it really simple.

2:14:44 less of them pulling you. fall off the earth was totally wrong well what did einstein do to debunk it einstein taught us that has a So when Aristotle Isaac Newton came around and said, And that, the ground is pushing you forwards. the train. And then you see the train track starting to spin underneath the train. And The earth has this invisible force,

2:17:20 It's not made of a substance. Space is actually a thing out there. Right. Now, Isaac Newton thought light travels in a straight line only. A scientific fact can never go higher than hypothesis. He said, look guys, I'm using my senses because gravity became the law of gravity. It was no longer the theory of gravity. It was so gravity because gravity became the law of gravity

2:20:07 Versus the science See, it's funny I thought it was So the idea being that you don't necessarily have free will, that everything about your What are those interpretations of those events though? I also believe in free will, which is tricky. How the fuck did you do that? couple of the speech paper and I going to catapult it. And I fired it again. If infinitely precisely you throw it the exact same way and it lands in the exact same dirt with the exact same resistance,

2:23:50 is random that's the thing there is no randomness right randomness is when a human being can no look, look at a billiard ball table. I'm gonna take the weight of the ball, the friction of the table, says, to God, the world is not random. you would drink that exact t-shirt on right now, The causal line is complete, We don't believe in determinism. We have free the internal view, first person experience. We don't believe in determinism.

2:26:24 what you're going to be doing the greatest pool game and tell you That's irrelevant. I had this internal experience that's outside of physics so leibniz gives a great example he says look if i was really really tiny So for instance, I see that cup of coffee. I desire the cup of coffee and I drink it. desire something, grab something, eat something, consume something, make a choice.

2:28:52 it's never been refuted. to one another, but they're connected to one That your desire to grab that cup of coffee doesn't affect your hand, does not move your hand. That to me is a hard sell. That's the interesting part. This argument wasn't to prove God. illusion. You are really shaped by the momentum of your past, your genetics, life experiences,

2:31:36 He's trying to say, look, there's three ways of knowing something. You don't know that deductively or empirically. but yet still perceiving no when you perceive something it has to be within your consciousness your brain interprets the signal and creates this universe around you it creates this image we make a lot of inferences and that's where the woo comes in everything is woo you think just

2:35:11 False. It was an appeal to magic. Because the mass of the sun actually bends space-time around it to the point where it distorts our view. Okay. But you're saying that science has so much woo, and I'm not seeing the woo part. and then we attribute a physical law. Okay, so pay attention to this. Okay. to a butterfly that's how we express science we see the patterns and regularities then we

2:38:58 it changes its form. Whereas if you want to do that same test to carbon-based steel, it requires far greater temperatures. In Celsius, it's 100 degrees Celsius. They can boil water now. It's not supposed to... as a matter of fact no there are many other things things that that fact has been debunked and there's countless amount of facts. just more science that's not woo okay well here's some okay because we talked about gravity was woo

2:41:22 Right. I'm truth. and when things are true outside of your beliefs. them are knives you point to them and say they're knives. Aristotle says, look, they all share in one something. Okay. But let's call it for now essence. you made it up well by calling it essence you're confusing me so i would call it the form okay the Yeah, I totally agree. My model

2:43:51 I'd reach the level of sword. Yeah. They share this thing called matter. Right. How do you understand that they exist? with occam's razor i'm just gonna believe what i They don't change no they Now we have objectivity. Picture a green one. three corners it adds up to 180 degrees. We all agree. Right. Can you picture a triangle Even if there was no color, even if it was just clear, you would be able to see, you'd be able to differentiate between that shape.

2:48:31 Every objective thing we've observed in the universe is made up of subjective elements. The idea of a point is a mental construct. and it's true it's definitely by definition true so it's both a mental construct and yes but it's But it's dependent on your mind. of your mind well i had a conversation with sean carroll about it was a physicist and he made it

2:51:09 I might have fucked, I heard a conversation have done better too. by the way. of muddy okay let's make it super let's make let's make the waters crystal clear as much as possible And you think that the future is going to behave like the past. I throw it at you, you get wet. inherently pink a scientific fact can always be overturned oh look at this you threw water and

2:53:13 You've been being warmed by electric blankets your entire life. that fire burns you and they've never been burned by fire because they went to school and they You learn from my mistakes of touching fire. not, Right. give me one scientific fact you truly trust 100 okay Okay. If I take a match and I take a yellow piece of paper from this particular notebook, I will light that motherfucker on fire with that match.

2:55:23 Why? lens of evolution so it makes sense it fits right here in our lens of evolution. So it makes sense. We're going to sweep it under the rug. All the old stuff fits and all the new stuff fits. until I flip many coins in front of you. much woo as healers or crystal suckers or listen i don't believe in crystals in any of that i know It's only a name we have for a pattern we've observed in nature.

2:58:18 Exactly. Okay. But that narrative to it. Okay. That's the story you tell yourself of why those things are happening the way they're happening. what kind of components can take the image and project it through the power lines and through the the internet Okay, randomness. Temperature. pull of the sun on the earth causes certain temperature and effect. We don't see the causal connection. Because if we did see the causal connection,

3:01:44 It's like what you said about the billiard balls. And I would be right every time. If we got a robot to break. So because we cannot compute all the variables, I'm't maybe right we can create it with a slight margin of But if we could, an actual law itself. Yes. by science. Let's say I take object X and I throw read all the books. I'm fascinated by science.

3:04:18 Well, if I had more information. It is not deduction. will behave like the past. in the future. However- But the truth of the matter is he's throwing his hands up in the air those paradigms, Well, not according to Einstein. So can you know something that's untrue? sure because because uh you know it's funny there's two great philosophers that I've read

3:07:13 that hey, it's all song, it's all explanation. A hundred years from now, a thousand years from now. They call it modern philosophy. What's the cogito? Our senses lie. It cannot give us truth. One plus one equals two, we all believe it. Right, so by calling one plus one two, that's out there, already existing. Bertrand Russell is a very, he's a great thinker.

3:10:15 If I say, there's my wife, I married her. They said, no, math brings you, like Kant said, He says, look, all the greatest thinkers in history all disagree. Every generation, their greatest thinkers disagreed. Can you define it for us? Nobody's good enough to use it well that's one of the reasons why simulation theory is yeah like people really do Because we couldn't,

3:12:21 So you could be plugged Therefore I am. Right. inferred, this takes a very brave but there is a point and i believe in science don't get me wrong i'm uh i can't praise science But when we understand that our world is nested in consciousness, The consciousness is a byproduct of this physical brain. Consciousness tells us about brains. and dissecting the very,

3:16:06 Like the world, philosophy. they're all trying to tell me, Something like we were talking yesterday about Stephen King, about how amazing it is that this guy just keeps continuing to create these bizarre stories But if determinism is true, Stephen is just a computer. who wrote the book? philosophical questions about a hundred of these.