Joe Rogan Experience #1264 — Timothy Denevi Transcript

Transcript

0:00 Here we go. Good to see you though, man. What's up? Good to be here and talk Hunter Thompson. My pleasure. So your book, Freak Kingdom. You can do whatever you want with your hands, man. didn't he do that with the great gatsby he did like a few times yeah my hand he like typed it out yeah i love that idea that he was trying to find like the rhythm of the words that's such a

1:46 when someone does. to plagiarize Richard Nixon's Nixon is the one. Exactly. Oh, if you plagiarize Nixon, that's okay. convention, but the inspiration, Nixon. I was like, are you, you're running on Nixon? That's Remember that? Trump ran on the werewolf. disciplined long career version he's like rational and he's there all the time like the 1980s were not the best.

5:15 the way we see you while everybody else Taibbi does that beautifully. evidence. Like, he didn't want the press around How did you get involved with writing this book? into Strange Rumblings in Azatlan, which is about a conspiracy within the Los Angeles Police Jamal Khashoggi's death has got a lot of journalists really freaking out. Like, what am I doing if I'm criticizing world leaders

8:50 On Wednesday night, Mayor Daley gave this order to clear the intersection of Balboa and Michigan because there was a protest going on, 5,000, 10,000 people. hit Thompson over the head. Cops jump in, I'm paying $100 a day. Yeah. I mean, that time is very similar in a lot of ways to what's going on today. I can't buy groceries. I mean, with Antifa on the left too. And that's why I love Thompson was as hard on the left

11:50 civilization that we live in that we all we all can get along together and most people don't want So that's why after Chicago, I love that he went back to Aspen. Thompson had more advantages than Acosta. And Acosta was being pursued by the LAPD, Right? Those are darker days when you couldn't communicate as well. I mean, there were people that had Nixon's point of view

15:09 And so Thompson, in a participatory democracy, almost a Jeffersonian democracy way, ran for sheriff by emphasizing personal agency and most of all trying to get out the youth vote, like people who had left the political system but were living in Aspen. trail in 1972, he's at the Nixon campaign. Nixon's giving his acceptance speech at the convention.

16:15 And I would have won. Thompson is amazing at that. it couldn't this was eviscerated by Thompson hope back then like that if these guys could do that and what's interesting now is um you know know it's weird i mean aspen's weird because a lot of the thompson's friends like lauren jenkins He seems like a good dude, go there yeah it's weird it's weird being there man when did you go how long ago was that i guess

18:51 Well, it was just cool. Dude, he came out. He lived right next to the Matrix. he had space again and being in the city was hard for him because he could write beautifully he gets enough credit for his effort. You know know one thing i found when writing the book i interviewed um i interviewed bob geiger um who fair and He took dexedrine to write and he had a drinking problem.

21:37 That is a little bit smoother in that sense. And he sent her, she still has the letter. For 40, 50 years she's had it. I think that Thompson means something different And so one of the ways I dealt with it was to just remove myself to 1968, that now if they read that, the fucking terror two weeks at least he carried a book well herbert walker the main the older bush was uh you know the original smart he carried his book around for two weeks at least he carried a book well herbert walker the main the older bush was uh you know much more of a reasonable

24:10 I'm not familiar with criticism about Mailer. I'm confused. Yeah, he went to Bellevue. What? that's somebody that's resonating right now with um what trump's doing and with the violence that to be able to run the country and so as soon as chicago's violence erupted the nixon campaign knew they'd won the election pappy cannon it's really interesting because even though hunter would shit on him

26:39 Like, I'm here to do this. Now, what was your idea behind writing this book like what what compelled you And he was kind of an exaggerated version of Hunter Thompson. assignments he wrote the straight articles for years to make money for his family and it wasn't he was relegated to that because he really didn't speak well. And you could barely understand a fucking word Hunter's saying.

29:32 by the White House. And Thompson just laid in the grass and he didn't go. nixon was somebody who said i'm just the poor son of a butcher. I'm just this like very hardworking, you know, American that represents all of us. Thompson was a few rows back. And the way a used car salesman who lies but can make a lot of money off it is skillful. and it was kind of sad.

32:04 I think Ali was something different to people than I think it's – I don't think we have someone like that today. And the rematch was on television. this guy was not just this heavyweight boxer. He was a cultural icon. He was a historical figure. That Ali had been past his prime. Because in baseball, you weren't allowed to get free agency for another team.

35:07 mangled version of himself what people sacrifice. but he knew that. It was indicative of, I think, the stress and the pressure that the last decade of covering Nixon had taken out on him. But that was the end, I think, of his arc where he was still on point. and looking for work in the mornings in San Francisco, you know, to try to support his yeah that's one of the things that he talked about that i thought was really interesting that he

37:42 And it was just too weird. Those are That was Was he who makes a beast of himself G gets rid of the pain of being a man. You know, And he's a voice and a light that we can have in this moment, which is another troubling moment in American history. i think matt taibbi on this show talked about it well where one thing is that um muskie was already who did Ibogaine.

40:32 What I think is more important than the Ibogaine story – so the Ibogaine story in the background is Ed Muskie was the frontrunner for the Democratic primary in 1972. Some people got it. your president, namely me. And it was repeated. The reporters were like, fucking, this is terrible. was, and was actually a pretty smart guy who was out of his mind in his mid-20s. They stayed out

42:54 It talks about how Thompson took his press pass, put it into the elevator, pressed the button, sent the press pass down to the ground floor. put cake in each other's face it's been really weird and people aren't reporting on it like other He's saying, young man, keep your mouth shut. Donald Segretti and Nixon's creep Watergate crew to fuck up Muskie's campaign. And that actually changed the course. Thompson helped

45:39 is what joan didion did really well he took the way the media was portraying somebody Everybody loves Jim Morrison. with them, and he ended up spending time with them. I don't think they got as mad at him about Well, Sonny Barger, Sonny Barger is so ridiculous. In September, they're like, here's our author photo, and it's shitty. That's the Rolling Stone one where the guy got stabbed? Yes, where Meredith Hunter was stabbed. But Tiny- committed suicide after Altamont, after being involved in the Altamont security situation.

47:58 Like Marion. it's a girl's name in your time um but eredith is a weird one though you must hate your fucking son man but lose an argument with your wife but that but i've lost a lot of arguments with my but that you funny or being like, dude, you drink, could be met with everybody beating you up But by 1965, that was no longer an option. representation of them because it was better than any other one right there's no better

50:30 And very dangerous too, to do that. It's a fire that you're putting your hand onto. He continued riding motorcycles though. He hits the coast highway and he comes down it. overwhelmed he says um you know the edge the only people that know it are the people that have gone over. And he sits at his desk. and then I give the three versions of the notes.

52:57 I'm done giving interviews about Honest Thompson. that i um did there's a beautiful. Anita is his second wife for folks. Yeah. because i had i believe if you interview somebody you need to read everything that exists already when we talk about football and so he talked to my favorite the whole ride it was it was in 1968 pat buchanan had helped set And it's like Pappy Cannon in the front.

55:38 He had taken Thompson to his first football game. Miller, who'd caught the pass. It was the only moment I mean, you have to listen to the other side. his shit in San Francisco in like the out to Colorado and did a wonderful job like reporting on how democracies were falling apart down there. he gets a knock on the door and it's this rancher named wayne wagner which is an old aspen family

58:35 He goes to Aspen. so when it was time to leave he thought again of um woody creek and of aspen which was so different There's a place called The Temporary. said, I looked around then and I felt, what the fuck am I doing here? And I had that in the notes I wanted to write it vividly. I think it's better in retrospect to go and report somewhere, you know, to like go and be at the middle of Congress and take notes.

1:01:53 then to also make sure that any question the reader would have but like why did you think I don't think he ever did it. joint uh on the grass somewhere with that las vegas visor on and he's you know talking about how from Louisville if you want to go after what do you mean by that? because I believe I need to go after these moments. And there's a lot of people that are using it to write.

1:04:39 You were medicated as a child? right like this world is incredibly painful so i take adderall now um and do you take it now? I take it to write. This world is incredibly painful, so I take Adderall now. And I take it to- How often do you take it? better than anybody so with him with dexedrine i, I'm not going to say Thompson was hyperactive. You're not doing well.

1:06:15 I mean, for me, it's like I'm not a good researcher. with this effort. I'm trying to make these beautiful things. I always think of James Salter, Right. And I think with alcohol, it's very clear, it is. And when you do that, do you feel weird no i just watch I mean, that's what Thompson and Burroughs and Southern. I believe that our American society, the situation I'm in, I have created a situation where I have too much work, and it it's my fault i should not be trying to be a professor and also go report at congress and also

1:09:35 Just because you have a path with the effort to be rich or be successful, that doesn't mean that's a good thing. I don't mean that. Till it wasn't. on um the new book on jan winner has great moments of thompson the 70s just being kind of lost yeah Was it somewhere in the Pacific Northwest? i was in san francisco was in san franc. And Hunter's just out of his fucking mind.

1:12:12 And, one of his great essays is from 1964. What do you mean by his narrative doesn't fit? when he wound up killing himself it it was almost unsurprising. Yeah. even if that's a logical outcome that that's not no i needed it so it's interesting i would say And he asked the question of like, should I include this detail? We have to take care of ourselves.

1:16:16 Like they basically use the ladder to get to the attic and now Trump's pulling up the ladder. But he nailed it, and he nailed it in a very, very unique way that still today, I mean, well, that was another thing I wanted to ask you about. Why did him and Tom Wolfe, like Tom Wolfe got some of his tapes from some of the, was it La Honda? They were fellow counterculturalists that are also outside of the ballgame.

1:18:12 And Kesey was like, yo, I'd like to meet them. Allen Ginsberg was there with Kesey. like red cake cups to the Hells Angels. so they hung out and it was interesting how acid pacified the angels instead of made them violent That's $300. so they go back into the party thompson realizes that neil cassidy who's blackout drunk who is dean good feminist writer like who's dear to me she's like denevy you wrote about a fucking white guy

1:21:52 No. So I stand by it. Stepped in and stopped everything? But long story short, Thompson goes back and he goes to Kesey and he goes, this is one of the worst things I've ever seen. I mean, he did describe it as horrific. why we talk about truth later in life thom, some biographies might have said that he actually recorded the event. Yes. That's not what I meant.

1:24:18 get the fucking images and details that he needs That was the first time Thompson ever took acid because he was so upset. anymore and instead he just walked around and like was at peace like it's always funny when nixon's um helicopter he saw it on on tv left the white house lawn what happens is that you know the wheels elongate just like that and I just had so much respect for Thompson's ability as a we

1:26:50 Beautiful. Dude, I got Hunter shit all over the place. Thank you. Tim Denevy on Twitter. another guy who's got a bunch of great and anita thompson does a great job on facebook and you know