Joe Rogan Experience #1574 — Jacques Vallée & James Fox Transcript

Transcript

0:00 The Joe Rogan Experience. Jacques Vallée, you have been studying this most of your life. clear sky, absolutely clear. At the time, I became convinced that it might be a prototype that the French UFO researcher trying to make sense of this in the military and so on. at the time, he was looking for a transition between the time when they know that, you know,

3:19 two screens that give you an angle you know Dr. J. Hynek who was with pieces of string saying, can you give us a comment on the Russian satellite? And Spielberg said, that's it, you know, that's it. And, you know, they've got the globe, in the movie. Yeah, it's a great movie. It is And I felt like if something was coming here from another planet that was so

7:14 And in Silicon Valley, When you first started studying this, James, friendship. I'm so sorry. This guy's gone. And I brought it up with a guy that I was mentoring. Well, I can only go by the people that were there. that was clearly just aluminum foil and sticks and stuff from a weather balloon. And it wasn't what you would do with wreckage from a weather balloon.

10:46 and all the other people that swear that it's nonsense that there is a phenomenon here on Earth that we still need to be discovering. You need to, Well, it seems like there's been so many reports over time and it's so Yeah, the tests, you know, and then the atomic bombs that were dropped on Japan. There was no cover-up. It was not of this world. that define the orbits of the, you know, of the atom and what goes into the nucleus of the atom.

15:31 Roswell was not unique. It was not unique in New Mexico. And now we have samples from Europe. We you know, and you have to differentiate between, you know, which, what goes into really making the If we find that, that's a revolution. We've got instruments now, new instruments The other thing is, you know, He was asked 30 years ago to look at some material,

19:36 Now, the problem that the people who have those vehicles have is they will, that that was the problem they were having. No. And we've never seen that material again. I had another conversation with a military man who is retired now, It was, again, very light, you know, So what is the current speculation on where the wreckage from Roswell went? where it comes from.

24:15 Okay, but hold on. Is anybody speculating as to where the material from Roswell is? any need for it. And then the electronics was in glass tubes and so on. the technology that we currently use came from. And they were all in on this conspiracy that it This was not really advanced stuff. someone I, you know, respect and admire, revealed that he was in charge for the army of getting,

27:47 So, again, that doesn't prove anything. glass fibers were known before World War II. Give it to MIT, give it to, I don't know, Battelle, It was right at the 50th anniversary of the Roswell event. stringy stuff that was later to be determined to be fiber optics and that the material had this you could crumple it up with light as a feather and then He didn't have time.

30:58 Not to get all the information out. Well, it's not a matter of curiosity. There are secrets the atomic secrets. are the P clearances, the Q clearances, the R clearances. There was the one person who worked at the Pentagon statements and just the release of the go fast video and the other videos uh from the um the uh yeah including russia you know i mean and certainly including france I mean, there was one incident in 1978,

34:49 They can take nuclear ammunition. but he was never really sure. 360 degree circle The report would probably not have come out And this was 1978. and the instrumentation and the radar, I mean, that thing was tracked on radar that saw the whole thing. So I'll read it. benefit from concealing the information. It is hard to believe that in There is obviously a glaring strategic mismatch

39:40 And so you told him you were coming on here The people that were involved with the incident want the photographs released. Yeah, see, that's a new thing. This is a change, right? And these things, though, it seems to be there's more of them and actual youtube video there's two ones from 94's from 94, one's from 2013. This is the one from Puerto Rico.

43:12 So weird to see. yes moving through the clouds one of the things i wanted to make a distinction of right angle turns at high speed, that thing moving around that was hovering over the ocean that it kind of darts You're not really looking at a visual picture. where his comfort zone was and so i was really kind of cautious for the first half an hour of the interview.

46:49 And I'm telling the story to Senator Reid thinking, you know, I don't know how he's And I said, well, hold on, Senator. And he puts his water bottle down. someone in the Pentagon, someone or some group at the highest level of clearance It went all the way up until it ended up on the front page of The New York Times in 2017. You know, I can't get to the basement of Walter Reed

50:03 so I know where it comes from, okay? and say, look, this proves it. Instantly, I mean. but the iconic close encounters of the third kind, The children are all consistent. that's incredibly similar it was all a classic looking ufo flying saucer type vehicle and a and remind you guys that I was making a film on UFOs, And I dismissed it so quickly because I thought, there's no way that a

53:24 Dan Farah is producing it. that there were roughly a 100 kids in the playground, You've got all these children saying what they saw on camera after it happened. to convey the reality of that moment to them to to to to be able to have this interpretation of But when I was reviewing in the studio the archival interview of the children, she just dropped off a cup of coffee and she stopped and went, oh, my God, those children are not lying.

57:02 with technology that are going to ruin the Earth. Yes. But no, I definitely had to ask myself, evidence, we have eyewitness testimony, And as much as I respect, you know, the task force, my colleagues and I want to cooperate is made up. There has been. and I got to know Brazil and the data there pretty well. If you turn on the light or a laser, So, you know, this is at least a demonstration of,

1:02:07 aliens from other planets and so on all these all these movies so that was okay and frankly not this is way off. I mean these are not just vehicles that come from somewhere multiple universes, about universes interpenetrating each other, maybe channels between those universe i was going to say jacques one of the assets that jacques brought to this film the

1:05:05 Long story, I was going to get a better space, Just electricity some of the time. I'm coming out. I revealed some of them in the movie. Austin has changed since 1962. And that's where you could do some physics. You can look at radiation. individually that were secret because of that radar was classified at the time. But the archives themselves were, you know,

1:09:17 They never looked at the testimonies, at the wires, at the teletypes. NORAD looks at everything, And he explained that, you know, They said, yeah, but we don't call them UFOs. And he said, doctor, it UCT? And he said, doctor, that's what he asked. It could be a weather balloon. was that the military was on scene within less than an hour. Yeah. police officer said he was told not to talk about it because it's one thing to explain away an

1:13:40 Those rocks are still here today. White-fitting or tight-fitting? got there to the local newspapers. The officer, Lonnie Zamora, had cut out those articles Well, that was, he was waiting for a case like that. because he knew those guys. And there were theories that this was an experimental thing from white sands. Egg-shaped craft, okay? Did we have tic-tacs back in 1964?

1:16:50 No exhaust vents, no wings, no tail. We found the real symbol at the National Archives Oh, so someone put if you put a fake symbol on it just so to see if people were hoaxing it doc Did they have all the characteristics that you're hearing from these other? He apparently got eye contact with one of the two beings That was the infamous Michigan landing.

1:19:48 that he pushed for congressional hearings, which we had congressional hearings. And here's the It was just one of those things We spent the whole day in the vault, you know, looking at the files and so on. I would love to take this opportunity to any of your audience out there. but why don't you be passing through to Hynek in 1964, 65, It's called Phenomenon 7.7, Empire Studios.

1:22:32 testimony footage We spent, my sister Kelly Fox worked as an archivist and Gordon Cooper and we found a year to get our hands on it. But this footage, what is this footage that you found show? I went and found the guy's wife. But it's the best documentation of the best close encounter of the third kind in U.S. history. and she didn't tell me until after the podcast,

1:25:26 And that was in, what year was that? Well, contact with who did the hypnosis of both of them separately We didn't get any aliens, but we had a lot of time to talk, And, you know, there are lots of stories and here is Barney driving and Betty next to him, And I've never forgotten that. A little over a decade later, you have Travis Walton, Snowflake, Arizona.

1:30:18 uh their car stopped on the road there's a case case, you know, two years ago in France that I investigated. suddenly, all the sounds stop. You know, the birds don't sing anymore. There are no dogs barking. So you're looking at perhaps a phenomenon well, it's a threat because it went around And it's similar in that everything stops. Or control consciousness, human consciousness, long enough to create an experience.

1:33:08 to Passport to Magonia, disturbing to me about them, like how similar the stories were. I mean, initially, he was, you know, he got interested because there were all these books about hypnosis and so on done by amateurs, people who are not trained in hypnosis. I mean, there were some of those books, they were planting the idea, So he got disgusted And then he gave up on that as he learned, as he did more and more interviews and understood

1:36:24 at more than the extraterrestrials So why would you come from and we're exploring mars you know now we're sending a probe you know we're sending a couple of probes to the moon we're bringing back because I know too much about it takes a team including the Air Force officers. I know what they went through, you know, including the Air Force officers.

1:39:02 There is some form of consciousness out there I mean, that's what the kids are saying. They have no wings, no tail, no visible means of propulsion. to me correct me if i'm wrong again because this is what you're getting at. What's the bigger picture? Yeah, so David Fravor who's the Navy pilot that had that dramatic encounter with a tic-tac off the coast of San Diego

1:41:50 Latin longitude strategic point of the military exercise. So how on earth, he said, how on earth and they will remember what they've seen and so on. 90% of it should be removed. You don't hoax about something that's that terrifying that people can check. It's a conjunction, you know, of Mars. That's why we have advertising. that will never be forgotten,

1:46:11 And that became gospel for the psychologists. The behavior seems to be you need to let go of some of the things you're doing They are humanoid. people that I was hanging out with about what I'd filmed already in africa the landing case and the telepathic message that these beings allegedly gave the children and I keep them in a very special place of what the kids saw that day.

1:49:39 hair on the back of my neck stand up going wow this is the one Gina's they There's the ones that look like the tic-tac. Tim Edwards. See? it had these two kind of apostrophes indicating some sort of communication telepathic um just If it just keeps going in that direction and if we keep with our integration with technology and electronics, like that, we might be something very different in the future.

1:52:15 when i brought the children together in africa as adults they had time to process their encounter there's this moment of intrigue and curiosity, almost like time stops. And what you're looking And so we are about to publish a book called The Best Kept Secret because some of it, some of what we've uncovered but most of the information was kept hidden by the witnesses.

1:54:54 it's their duty to report something to And you've got to, you know, gain their trust and sit in the kitchen. And if you're lucky, they give you a cup of coffee and you talk. And it's going to change history. How is it going to change history? And then we've been looking for patterns around that case. What you would find was a commonality of the structure has to do with the intrusion in the life of someone.

1:57:52 You know, they know exactly where they were, what they were doing. These materials are earth materials, okay, in most cases. whether it's a military or scientists or ufologists. I mean, in Brazil, And we're learning something from this experience. And the more you have stories like the 2017 story in the New York Times the more this comes it's almost like a slow

2:01:13 behind the scenes working diligently to get it to come out, that it's going to have a very unifying and, you know, sort of readjust is oriented towards a threat. like all the sophistication that they have, the tracking systems, the satellites. he couldn't have launched. You know, I mean, you know, it's kind of interesting. I mean, that has to mean something, right?

2:05:13 we've got incursions over those platforms And as you said, something that the general public is always because i'm joe public myself i mean i'm a guy unidentified objects whizzing around in our You know, I don't think I've ever mentioned this to you. You have lunch with somebody and then you talk. And Amy Michelle says, what did you find out from your superiors?

2:09:09 You know, the religious ideas would float around. You should talk to people on the street. It's a really dramatic encounter. Where's the propulsion? How on earth is this object flying? It's what's happening exactly today. that have been, again, kept hidden, but reassuring superficially, And he suddenly realizes, maybe that wasn't such a good idea. contact, I tried to shoot this thing.

2:14:25 Where they shot what? and Jacques and I went back and forth on this for a long time, for crisis management, Again, the mid-80s, to link together It wasn't accessible by people outside. It was just operated by the international, you know, industry essentially of atomic power. or the only non-government people there. I mean they told us don't even go into the nuclear war thing

2:18:08 to get all the people who need to know, And government needs to continue. He's one of two or three Americans who were knighted. showed him where that was and why there were missiles. and briefed President Kennedy, to brief Charles de Gaulle, President de Gaulle, about the U2 shutdown over the Soviet Union. He told me about 1952. He was very interested

2:21:08 The committee took it somewhere and analyzed it. by Nick Mariano. Those were inversions of temperature there were, you know, there was tracking, radar, you know, radar tracking of it. out of one of the disks. The piece of metal. and we have the guy that was actually in the radar room, this guy Al Chop, didn't know what to tell the pilot they could see on the radar all the discs all these ufos around

2:24:38 and I finally said, Jacques. Why would you want to wait? You know, I respect the need for certain things to be managed in a particular way. Disclosures come in layers. So, you know, fast forward after 1952. artificial things in the sky or whatever, they could saturate the communication and of the film. channels that were vital were in a complete shamble.

2:29:28 I also punch the cards for that, has no idea what an onion skin is. And which is interesting by itself. I became a US citizen a couple, you had to wait five years before you could apply for that would have changed certain things. Well, it turned out that group turned out two things. Well, okay. which basically is an unknown government agency but this is premature.

2:33:47 are. so that the public would have a place to write They were the ones who invented titanium aluminide. They were the ones who invented some of the coatings which I really didn't want to expose, But Joe's question is, examine the medal? Art Rondal told me that because, number one, you know, he knew that I knew the rest of the story. We have others. What do we have?

2:38:20 Other people have similar things if it has the same characteristics of metal that you would find here on Earth? to the point of, for example, So they haven't tested anything that shows that it's clearly extraterrestrial? And for a long time, we only had, you know, a pinhead worth of stuff, of metal that you can say, this And we'll compare notes. It oxidizes very quickly.

2:42:40 But if we can verify it and if we can look at the ratio of the other isotopes and so this metal is extraterrestrial correct refined and manufactured? Yes. And Gary said to me, and some of which We don't understand it. because they had all the people who signed that memo were metallurgists. And I asked the same questions you're asking. so it's extremely exciting but they're it's too early to make any concrete statements.

2:46:55 Yes. with that matrix of orthosilicate. The Air Force colonel who told me about the thing tried, they wouldn't publish it. What other kind of evidence is there? can and have been explained away You've got landing prints in the ground. this like a taboo subject that we have to all, you know, shy away from. Well, whoever has a So I think we should get the pressure on for further government transparency.

2:50:59 that was huge. we pay you guys you should be able to tell us if it's I can measure, I can tell you how much snow fell that night because I measured it. got these climate prediction schedules, we can approximately tell you where it might melt, and where it's going to go when it melts, and how big the reservoirs are going to be, with her two babies in her arm,

2:54:26 governor the governor would have to tell the sheriff and the sheriff would have There is a good reason for that. they were in the woods right uh snowflake arizona i think was 1975 it was a logger right it was a And he told the driver, Travis Walton, stop the truck. dangerously close to this thing. So he was going to make a run for the truck and he got up as this

2:57:32 no, no, let's stick together. So they all stick together in the truck. They turned around, They said, you know, they stuck to their story, That was the most remote. minimized any possibility of their exposure they dropped him off in a place where he could get help blurry eyed but he could see these little beans and initially thought i was what am i looking at

2:59:55 And he started aggressively swinging some instrument totally freaked out didn't know where he was, and he was having a hard time breathing. And he took a left, and he went into this room, and there was a command chair. And and he said, oh, my God, you guys are here to save me. woman. I said, well how do you know it was a woman? He said, it was a woman.

3:01:44 There was a movie made about it called Fire in the Sky but the disc was just leaving, departing, and it was five days later. Whoa. Yeah, and there was a movie made about it called Fire in the Sky. These motherfuckers. But I decided in the movie. His story is exactly the way. just running towards the spot. It's a very compelling story. He was working at like a Walmart.

3:03:35 he describes it, he made the correlation of a Corvette, a brand new Corvette. Isn't that funny? all these household names that are not only looking at it participating but publicly endorsing it and that is extremely exciting I firmly believe that. apocalypse now okay he's like the pinnacle of success editor and he's That's so amazing. I mean, if you walk

3:06:25 we feature it road to Rua that landing case in Africa It's so hard, and it's so easy to be incredulous. You should listen to him on, I don't know if you've listened to him on, And it's an insane story. The thing is, you could only see the water breaking over the top of it. Reid. They had to see the government documents. They had to verify the existence of AATIP. I mean,

3:09:15 And the Navy finally just said, communicating with the what was it the ship well who's he communicating with it was telling them Yeah. And I can't recommend the documentary enough if you're into ufos like uh i am obviously it's uh the He's been incredibly supportive of us. on Amazon. And when will that be available? Bye, everybody.