Joe Rogan Experience #1613 — Ayaan Hirsi Ali Transcript

Transcript

0:00 The Joe Rogan Experience. my publisher would say, all of the mainstream media agencies, CNN. but we i had one invitation from a magazine called bust b-u-s-t it's for girls and women lined up and a photographer. When, in my view, J.K. Rowling, the author of Harry Potter, when, in my view, JK Rowling came out in support of women. But I'm told that I make the people who read that particular magazine unsafe, or

3:25 And she had woman spelled in different ways. People who menstruate, I'm sure there used to be a word for these people. against women in in these sports and she gets labeled like the most vicious bigot alt-right They take away your genitals. And I admire J.K. Rowling for taking that fight on. But it must not be zero-sum. At the expense of biological women.

7:19 by saying people who menstruate you're talking about women and to deny that and say no we're just going to yes, we are women. parameters around which you can work. There has to be common truth. There has to be objective truth. It's going to cause even more chaos, is that people are being enforced to behave and communicate in a way But you can't say they've always been a woman.

11:57 You just mentioned somebody who fathered children. you know, when it comes to certain things that suit me, you can't pick and choose. i think it is very very important that we come out as a nation as a people uh any anyone who You briefly talked about that, but for people who don't know you, And then finally, in 1992, I ended up in the Netherlands.

16:02 But in Kenya, my mother, who was with my grandmother, her mother's all I want to say to her is, this is superstition. They can't read the Quran, so they have to trust in what he tells them, the Hadith, at such an early age i'm in fourth grade i had the fortune to actually go to school and be taught and what happens when that mosquito comes and injects its, what do you call it,

20:24 and all of that, and we wouldn't have malaria because that's how it is. So I found myself, even at that age, confronting grown-ups who were established, And this is what made you flee and head to Europe and wind up in Holland, correct? He was gone for 10 years. that culture is the father's responsible who were forced into these arranged marriages. And I, to this day, say I am grateful that my father left us when he did and came back when he did.

24:20 What kind of future would I have had? And they had to know their place. I wholeheartedly agree with you, You're breaking the rules and the laws and the norms and the customs. No, I was not alone. of us and you're doing what you're supposed to do what you were created to do by God you're What did you know about the way women were treated in Europe would miss what was that game called that's that's chicken chicken yeah a game of chicken

30:11 You go to a lot of trouble to get out of the house and lay down this whole, you know, this friend is going to be on the lookout for you. and we were mesmerized. After you've solved one of the most complex mysteries, confrontations between the Soviets and the Americans, you close the book and you look around you and everything says you need to do these dishes before your mom comes here and whacks reality on the ground, which is not what I would call...

32:17 We didn't have boys because boys could get away and go find hide somewhere. particularly stood out? yeah. There were some really if movies were made for teenagers I'm not sure they gave But we always understood, like I said, as soon as that thing goes off, you go back straight to your reality. I don't want to have you around me. I'm also the in-between child.

36:43 My brother would hang out with Kenyans. So that was all very awkward and weird. He found a place about like a 30-minute drive with no traffic, And it's just like that. And I meet him. And there are two chairs pulled up, and my father's sitting on one, and please forgive me, We thought, how could you be in Canada all this time and not speak? He's a member of our extended family.

41:02 wonderful, you're properly covered up. So how did you manage to get out of here I need to get out of here so how did you manage to get out so he's a Canadian citizen with a job and he had to go back he came for two things he came to look for members of his family who were fleeing out of he leaves. So it's now in July of 1992, the travel document issued by the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees is ready.

43:22 family of our clan who live in Bonn. Germany. And that's the Netherlands, it's Belgium, it's Luxembourg, You take this train and does he keep his mouth shut or does he tell anybody that you escaped on the And when I'm in the train, she says, this is what you do. and had been shunned herself by the family. Well, if you ask for asylum. And she said, if you ask for asylum, then you get into the process.

47:39 country. You'll be shot. Something bad is going to happen to you. And he comes over and he says, would you like a cup of tea or coffee? And so it's things like that, small things like that, He directs me to the reception area and he says, talk to these people. I become a refugee. Because in the end, they do find me because the way it works with Somalis is no one is looking for your name or your date of birth.

51:15 I think she was with Father Moore. I was sent to a place called Luntren You can do whatever you want. We lived in what Americans would call a trailer park. and then take them to the little living space, a forced marriage and the guy I was married to is in my caravan and he's with three other guys your government is going to figure out I lied in my asylum.

54:33 And I say to her, call the policeman call the police and when they arrive they they sit me down and they go through it are you sure this is what you want to do and I keep nodding And they don't recognize that. So he leaves. over the age of 18 years It doesn't work like that. but where we were, all the homes are these trailers. anything and I mean little houses

58:32 i arrived in 1992 in july it's the summer months women are dressed in shorts tank tops t-shirts is that crazy to you it looked it looked otherworldly to me were roller skating this is is crazy. Yeah. Yeah, and like... four guilders cost five dollars. so i would call my I wish I kept a journal. And as women, men from those parts of the world would actually start harassing us and treating us badly.

1:01:51 And they would say, but why do they do that? There are things that we go, oh, I didn't think that things were done that way. There was a man from Iran who kept looking at my skin and staring at it. I walk out of, you know, where you have to go turn your laundry in and get the fresh laundry. anything about some of my as well you know in the camp mates, they came from, so I knew there was a country called Yugoslavia.

1:04:32 or you'll be in big trouble. What are they fighting about? And this is a country that's trying to be generous things that were going on were crazy and what universal language were you suppose the english They say, you've got to fill this form again, you've got to fill that form again, you've And so you have to get over that. so you try to get lawyers in holl In Holland, yeah. And my guess is,

1:08:27 so if he were a lawyer would say there must have it must be some kind of law my father advises and so I had to go and sit in that caravan with all of these members of my clan I wasn't going to go into that space without having the backing of the police. So they can't drag you out of there? I don't want to have anything to do with the family. You're all on your own. This could end

1:11:32 Well, horrible stories is you're sitting and it is like, are and they would like sort of spell it out. There'll be no one for you. You could end up being a prostitute. You will be sold into slavery. There's no one who cares about you. you know, rational, you're not going to be one of us. And there's no one on my case. we are going to take this up with your father.

1:14:11 I think the one thing I worried about was, well, now I've put myself out there. Do you have anticipation about the future? And that's, it was, I was literally terrified into it terrified into learning dutch and joining obviously I didn't like that. Wow. And I went out of a network and I went straight into a different network. In Holland. And you have the electorate, you have all the different institutions, you have the different layers of, you know, from the city to the province to we didn't have a federal, but the nation.

1:19:24 And from the second half of maybe 2003, they're moving me from place to place. and this goes on for a while but i get to a place where the threat is considered to be so intense And the think tank that I was working for, and ethnicities and colors. into Parliament I still have all these men around me and the security It fell because of me because the Minister for Immigration and Integration decided to take away my citizenship.

1:22:34 But there was a left-wing documentary company that said they were going to make a profile of me. she did it well I am lied about her life why is she still in Parliament so she Wow. level I don't let that get under my skin the way it doesn't bother me the way it He's doing it because people are poor. They happen to be Muslim, but they have no intentions of perpetrating terrorist attacks,

1:27:28 And because it's so contested, we Americans and Westerners, and I'm only going to give it to the good Muslims, you will never be able to fight Islamist terrorism, But then the Prophet Muhammad had two careers, one in Mecca and one in Medina. I'm a peace loving Muslim, I don't want to impose my religion on anyone else. The peaceful Muhammad is not Medina.

1:32:10 Because in Medina, Muhammad made it very clear, you spread the religion by word of mouth, by example, but also by the sword, by violence. adapt it to our times. They go about What is stopping them from recognizing that this is an issue? It's an opportunistic term. It's just a small group of people who have lost their way, You could be ignorant of something,

1:36:12 there is almost that parent-child relationship And they saw that you couldn't do that. It's just like Christianity. along religious lines are going How would they possibly enforce that? But there's something about the thing that covers your face, It's all out the window because of COVID. a liberal society would be very careful with, and comes out of their mouths.

1:40:52 some of these intrusions into our privacy, into our liberty, that would, you know, it would stop and we would be able to be free. Why can't they sit inside? going to be like the Spanish flu and kill a vast majority or a large percentage, rather, And that's, so anytime people say you should be suspicious of government, don't give government any powers because once they have that power, they won't give it back.

1:43:16 You know, there's a evidence whatsoever that it spreads outside and they said it's for optics so they're closing voted out of power if they carry on like this i don't know if they will i don't know if they will People, they treat it like it's a bad cold, which is what it is. It was like a headache. Well, you can't open. that she probably didn't even have to set this up

1:46:40 they're doing something the cases rise because here's the thing about lockdowns And that's part of the problem. Yes, inside. And they're more they keep getting paid no matter what when they close down these businesses i think the government because the park's shut because they're worried about covet like these are some of the rules that Yes. But people like him can't get their voices out

1:50:17 Front National, that's the populist far right party led by by Marie Le Pen came in second. And next year they have elections then voters want something done. so-called homeschooling where young people are taken out of the normal schools and indoctrinated Just listen to them. And back then they were thinking, okay, the civil war is on. Well, France has a relationship with Algeria.

1:54:20 And the population is faced with terrorist attack after terrorist attack, attempts at terrorism that are foiled. So this is kind of their last chance. And this is happening in other places in Europe as well, right? It's a mix. Easy question, right? which is the government agencies that are paid to collect the data, that kind of data, they won't do it.

1:58:26 that there is an abundance of sexual attacks by these immigrants? will say, please don't put my name in the book, don't quote me. But they explain and the of who is exactly perpetrating what kind of crime, that they're going to gather the data as the data presents itself. I have looked at a program developed by a man Those who don't want to, those who don't want to learn, and those who want to carry on assaulting women, I think they should get out.

2:02:18 and so much work that is devoted to what we call intimate partner violence. So sexual violence They're young people. They're new to the country. They're out and about. They're not out after dark. why do you think there's a reluctance to communicate with But I know what you're saying. Why is it? What would the retribution be? The immigrant, the asylum seeker, the refugee, he is supposed to be the victim.

2:07:42 You know, all the airwaves all day long will be about Governor Andrew Cuomo ears so that they can't hear the sexual assault that is thrown at them, the obscenities that are They talked constantly about Ted Cruz going to Cancun. they should not be surprised 2016 people were surprised oh my god how could it happen why especially in relationship with adversaries,

2:10:46 once trusted institutions you don't know and trust them anymore I mean that's I read a whole analysis written on New York Times that they deliberately decided not to do journalism and go post-journalistic. It's terrible. And this is the problem we're seeing with the far left. value has been cast out in favor of things that get more ratings and more clicks and in favor of

2:15:02 And then they have children, and they have families, and they don't have time to sit down and analyze what's happening in in in yemen they don't have time they don't have time And so exactly what you describe is this complete lack of leadership. I know Americans love to cheer for this group against that. But to sit in a group and think we have something in common that they don't have, and we're going to take a hostile attitude to the other side.

2:18:15 On the other hand, when I travel around the country and I tend to talk to people, I seek them out and I will talk to the people actually I'm not supposed to talk to. I'm an outsider, I have an accent. And the way people respond, you know, the please, thank you, just the civility, the kindness. that there's just too much to pay attention to. And so people, they form convenient narratives, and they stick with them.

2:20:38 this person or this group is going to stop you from doing that is one of the narratives that's a real problem in this country. Well, bad information, but can't you stop them by giving out good information? Because Donald Trump comes around and he says, hey, these people don't like you. And I would say I wouldn't censor anything. But you are shouting your political beliefs from the rooftops,

2:23:40 kind of speech they're not going to promote, depending on the business objectives and the bottom line. I totally agree with that. But what you said earlier, if those than for them to be shut down or broken up. is outsourcing censorship that they can't do, We need some kind of new rules. simply a private company so are they a utility or are they publishers because

2:27:05 a right to utilities yeah you only can say i don't like the way you think about this you can't have something happens I just hope that the right thing happens and that's the wrong And it was a Unity project. That's really painful. Irreversible Damage. everyone we want to promote uh transgender rights uh privileges transgender dignity i think that's

2:30:47 women. And I know some of the examples that are discussed are, you know, what happens in prison contagion young girls hating their bodies that's not new we've known that for ages and ages as long And then under pressure from other teenagers, I mean, there's so much wrong with transgender activism right now It's a forced compliance with the ideology.

2:33:42 He was talking about this very thing. I'm asking you about children. And I thought, but this is just like female genital mutilation. Listen to those people. a to me it's emblematic of this confusion in our culture now and also this newfound ability to This is not like a binary thing. that's and start medication at that age i think that is insane it's insane but the and bring in

2:37:57 children that if they that there was a study that he brings up in this and that you're allowing children to be pushed in one direction or the other. are easily influenced. why are you interested in this subject? the government to adopt hate legislation. I'm going to try and get you canceled from your i'm competing my i can wrestle with you yeah right yeah

2:42:13 put on it and in it one of the people put about forence griffith joiners world record that like And the idea that you're somehow or another discriminating there's science that points to the opposite right there's world records being broken left and right who has sex with women and has fathers a bunch of children then decides that he's a woman The thing is, most Americans don't agree with this,

2:45:25 it was a few years ago when the bathroom walls broke out. And you know, it's just, it's, it's just crazy it is one of the most yeah human entanglements in terms of like the way people are She transitioned for two years. Not bigoted, it's crazy. really crazy the thing that's going to happen is they'll be will withdraw So all of these things that they say that they're pushing for,

2:49:19 It's just sad. It's tragic. So she's cheating because she's taking testosterone. It's like biological women in all these situations are the ones that are losing out. And I think many of us, we're embracing, we're happy, we're open. everything hate speech, then you get to a place of really nastiness and suspicion. They haven't gone through puberty. who will come on your show and tell you that there are more than two sexes?

2:51:54 they just want to separate what they believe most nonsense argument i've ever had he's like well what's the difference there is no male there equal. because I think this conversation is going to be only people can you push the microphone up so it's only going to be about people who agree that only reproduces through some sort of experiment. chimpanzees or gorillas they're much more muscular and hairy and they have very clear genitals, especially chimps.

2:55:38 but i wonder what this is i wonder you, there's many people that have been trying to study and figure They're trying to fight this ideology, critical race theory, critical justice. And so one way of pushing back against those people is by refusing that claim, Yeah, exactly. Yeah. we can just say she she caitlyn jenner is a she let's say that yeah yeah so then what we're then doing is we are slowly because they demand and when i say they i'm not talking about

2:58:57 are multiple people and whatever else that they they come I'll use the word words. They just want to impose what the word is supposed to mean on you You're racist. So I'm happy to debate with her in a civilized way. it's i don't know if it's that simple i know what you're saying but i don't know if it's that simple I would say, a very uncomfortable situation for them.

3:02:12 And then they don't understand when everybody that would be very fascinating. Yeah. I mean, how do you make them fill out a form? And they don't want to be seen as not compassionate so most They don't agree with it. they just this is that that's their religion. yeah there's a lot of crazy belief systems that people join and they agree to and when you agree

3:05:42 With wokeness, yeah. Yeah. i think that same shit is happening right now with wokeness that is scary it is scary yeah it's pretty scary stuff. believe that they don't believe that. yeah exactly oh gosh i wanted us to end on a happy note but don't you think that's probably the case You know, the word blasphemy, you're a blasphemer. gosh what is it called the the latest one whose book who's i abram x candy oh i don't know the title and so

3:10:38 and then you use other words to explain what it means. This is just a story of who I am and everyone was saying, oh, just relax. And people were like, why are you focusing on this? So basically he was forced to find someone who doesn't exist for eight months. like Evergreen are now in the workforce and they want diversity now because for them it's an article

3:14:31 So they have to scream at you. especially by mocking them. But with all the, you know, using all the means, peaceful means, not vile. That was a really very fun and interesting conversation and very enlightening I'm reading it. And I have a website. Bye for now.