Joe Rogan Experience #1624 — Mark Sisson Transcript

Transcript

0:00 the joe rogan experience train by day joe rogan podcast by night all day I wanted to save it for the camera because you're going to tell me how great you like Miami. And we had gone to Miami Beach for a week every year for vacation, The sand is nicer. Fat tire bike, yeah. No one cares. That's a good endorsement. Why are the cops shooting pepper spray balls at them?

3:06 Is that bad? Different schools? You know, the whole school strategy and the So they kept that and they opened the insides of the restaurant. I mean, in Miami, and now they're staying there. their approach to the lockdowns, I think that's correct Yes. You look fucking great. I mean, if you have a strong immune system, I think you're going to do well during this.

6:32 Exactly. talking shit about it for a long time. Like, you know, don't, you know, it's not whatever. And Can we talk about that for a second? Because some people will argue that it's the balance of LDL and HDL and that cholesterol is actually essential for production of sex hormones and a lot of the notion that we would take this amazing molecule that is basically life-giving in many

9:18 that people made it out to be. And if you look at other studies, cohorts of people who've had cholesterol I think most people at the top are too greedy and stupid to organize into a cabal, right? at the end of the day, he found that there was a correlation between high saturated fat intake higher incidence of heart issues. And the drug industry certainly got on that. And that's why

12:52 CoQ10 with statins. A friend of mine said that when he did the original, when he was researching have high cholesterol. all year and haven't had any sun exposure, their vitamin D status has been compromised tremendously. So if you look at those vitamin D status, cholesterol, blood sugar regulation, Yeah. We were terrified a year ago. She works out.

16:10 So she sits home and watches movies for 10 days. not the case but there's still ridiculous people out there that are they're they're in excited by annoying people that look for an opportunity to tell people what to do and this is one of those whatsoever for any spread of this disease with outdoor contact. It's very similar. Get in there. excellent stuff, and it seems so

19:23 were kind of told that this is going to be your situation from here on out. we evolved over, you know, two and a half million years of human evolution and a hundred that looks at what happens at the level of gene expression, It seems so simplistic when you put it that way. Guys who go to the gym every day and train two hours because they like to eat.

21:51 How stupid is that, really? or I'll have a couple of bites of pizza once in a while. on here and talked about that. Have you had Kate on here? No. I've had plenty of people talk about that. industrial seed oils, got rid of the sugar, got rid of the processed and whole grains in my case. the way the world eats. Cause I thought to myself, you know, if I spent my whole life

25:12 And that's what happened, and it changed my life. that grains, whole grains, like that term, whole grain. I don't know who that is. I mean, basically, it was about sexual— So he prescribed some very bland grain cereals for people to eat. Yeah. Imagine that, like, sexual urges are caused by porn. They didn't have porn back then, really. It's a ridiculous idea.

28:08 You're good to go. Yeah, with low-fat milk. Raw, whole milk. is messed up. And it's the health police, because they think they know what's best for everyone And anytime there's a new problem, they create new committees, and they want to pass new laws and new regulations and hire new something, you're going to enact legislation. And what if for a couple of years people got

31:03 They have to maintain their freedom. which is, by the way, terrible for people's self-esteem, mental health. and you borrowed $300,000 to keep your restaurant open. And then all of a sudden, there's another lockdown. And now it's even more egregious. really, really popular for their stances. Yeah, well, because everybody wanted to, they wanted to consume that fear porn.

33:07 And this is what drives me crazy. 100%. like 42% of the people gained weight, Yeah, I'm not believing that. That's a big change in your body over 30 years Yeah. Let's make one up right now More women The average of 37 pounds for a man is fucking bonkers. shaming yeah which is so nonsensical and it's just designed to protect lazy people or excuse me maybe

36:53 You don't even know what you're saying. And not only that, but here's where it gets even worse. Her ex-husband, Wow. Right. Bro, she looks fucking fantastic. Look, if you're big and you want to wear hot clothes, you should be able to do whatever you Right. and successful and unhappy, okay, that didn't work, right? If happiness is really what we're seeking as individuals,

39:38 Yeah, this is a weird thing that people keep trying to push. And it flies in the face of What is the idea behind that? Why two meals a day? Why not just one? And in so doing, you can choose to do it or not. the time. Yeah. I mean, I have a lot of friends who do keto the whole time. I'm just, I'm not a you never get to the point where you're burning fat efficiently or effectively. So you're really

42:42 to burn fat, to burn ketones, for sure. That's the best strategy. So because as long as you keep feeding your body carbohydrates accumulate body fat. You never get really adept at burning body fat, and you never, because you to get glucose for a while, it starts to go to a plan B, which is to build the metabolic machinery to start glucose. And it would normally go that route, but we never give it the reason to.

46:07 No, humans are wired to overeat. That's – sure. So it's conveniently located over the center. and they just decide to fast, it'll still seek glucose. And if you don't give it glucose and you haven't done this work, And so the brain is still looking for glucose. You do cannibalize muscle tissue when you go long periods of time without eating. A few pounds.

50:09 You'll be dead. No, I'm talking about intermittent fasting. they report all this energy. They feel great. They feel amazing. Like any of these, this, when you're, one of the things, one of the many things that happens when you fast is that your body is to pass the genetic material along to the next generation, so there's plenty for two of us, so Why do you hate the term? It's overused?

53:01 No, no, no, we don't know. your body to be more metabolically flexible in that way? it's a necessary thing, but the good stuff all happens when we're not eating. It works for me. I mean, you can do 16, you can do, I mean, anything less than, importantly, I'm not hungry. I mean, hunger for a while because once you develop the flexibility, More food than we need for sure.

57:31 way of looking at life. How much of a glutton can I be every day, every meal? So I did the reverse can eliminate 25 or 30% of the calories you used to eat with zero adverse effect and probably Like the science community could not get their head around that for a long time. So in your book, do you set a guideline, like how to get this started and what to do?

59:55 And then about... Where'd that number come from? to really appreciate the effects of food on the body. But I still have like a book a year in me, No. It'll be based on your body mass and what kind of activities you're involved in. you heat it up you can microwave it yeah and some the skillets you do in a in a skillet pan I'm sorry, I meant how many people do you distribute these to?

1:03:54 there's going to be nobody coming into our stores, But we're, by purchasing Primal Kitchen products and showing a proof of purchase, we'll donate one of these meals to families in need. So the amount of R&D side. So the amount Obviously, you're not eating the same for the so I mostly have steak, but if I'm out of steak or whatever and I'm in a... More for me.

1:06:22 Like the carnivore diet, it's a thing. This really is a And when I'm done, I'm full. But I started cooking some stuff recently over an Argentine-style grill where you cook over wood, just plain old wood. gets ignited especially if you've killed the meat yourself then it adds an extra thing yeah if you've It's been the big cliche in his life I'm like, well, I've got to have my steak.

1:09:28 But this time I was hanging it off a stick, and it was great. in your meat you're getting all of the chemicals from that plant in you. And if you shave that plant, you know, and then stick it in your meat, I had to learn, when I got to a condo in Miami Beach, I got to learn how to cook in a pan on an No. Yeah, well, whatever. Yeah, whatever. You don't use it.

1:12:01 you think you're eating i mean i'll I'll typically finish a 12-ounce steak. By his damn self? Okay. I might say, well, you know, there's a line that I'm not going to cross because I love the taste, That's what I like for dressing. This year I kind of cheated a lot. The insulin is—well, you're raising your insulin. The insulin is, well, Yeah. Many of these are locked in a fibrous matrix, so it takes a while for your body to digest them.

1:15:52 I'm sorry. I mean, you can have a healthy dessert. Yeah. And those keto desserts are mostly bullshit. but is made with erythritol and allulose and all this other stuff. I'm glad you brought that up because I think there's real promise in these meats Yeah. Yeah. No. They need to clone headless animals with no souls. a denser, healthier animal. Make a note.

1:19:22 His book is all about the benefits of regenerative agriculture. one of the big arguments against everyone eating vegetables is monocrop agriculture which is and how bad it is it's so You have to use all these different methods to keep animals. pesticides with uh all sorts of different methods of eliminating insects if you care about insects You and me might be dead, but Jamie's going to ride this out.

1:23:12 understand why people don't recognize that What you need is natural grasslands, which is what these... shit on the ground that shit fertilizes the grasses and fertilizes all the other plants When the people in tech go It's people people just don't like to eat. Yeah. But it's just the idea that people don't like to eat. And he would always say, I hate food.

1:26:03 My 10-year-old daughter loves it. No, I don't know. And some people, I think their taste buds are just fucking terrible. Yeah, well. It's also a matter of reprioritizing the way you look at your life. workouts they're written out and i've done that a lot recently and i've really enjoyed it because This is what I'm eating today. I think. And with regard to, you know, eating, one of the issues that I saw people have is,

1:29:21 A morning meal from 8 to 9 is not the most important meal of the day. It's like this is what—the problem is if you're not accustomed to it, you do not have as much energy as you do. Great, yeah. but I just had a protein bar on the way over here. Every workout. Let's go out in the sand. You're on the beach, because this is... Right. But you not have left. I would not have left. Yeah. Right.

1:32:11 And, you know, congratulations on the massive success as a comic or comedian? It's just not too far from Lincoln Avenue. Yeah. especially at this juncture because because one of the things You know, so I think we've gotten to the point where every state ought to be considering opening back up fully. and they think it'll parse out Dude, I wonder what it is it's like

1:35:12 Well, when they say the science is settled, the science is never settled. head yeah there's no chandelier outside when there's a chandelier over your head you're inside which is just so bananas. reluctant to accept that evidence. Yeah. is going to bounce back real quick. And I've had several businesses in California. on track. Um, and then as we got a month away from, uh, opening, we lost your application.

1:37:54 day, and you couldn't bypass the switch, but this was a regulation. Then when I went to sell No, and if I were a young person, is so critical for people trying to figure out who they are and what they are who they who they That's not what freedom is. Edge took like 15 years to get his approval. Why did it take so long? he finally finished his tennis court.

1:40:16 But I've found a new... as big around as this as this uh bunker here um just spectacular yeah and i think they burned in No, but I'll give another example. My house burned in the Malibu fires, in the Woolsey Oh, Jesus. oh, they protect the rich folks. Yeah, never gone across like that. The second night, the winds picked up and embers from burned down houses a mile away

1:43:21 and my daughter's in the house. Yeah. because no supplies could come in through PCH. Yeah. And with a water hose, which, by the way, was down to a trickle because the firefighters were using all of the major hydrant when the pressure had dropped. all these different spots it wasn't just one spot and it was pretty obvious it was headed our way so and says, have you left yet?

1:46:21 And then if you're there while that's happening, you can get stuck, much fuel that's one of the things I love about here. It's green. Ladybird Lake. It's the one engine and they're all jet skiing Those things are wild, man. It's like snowboarding. So good powder day. Oh. You have a little Bluetooth indicator. It's so weird to see. Do you do any surfing?

1:49:29 Oh, yeah. What? I can't be fucking around with this paddle board and shit. But that sounds preposterous to me. Just lie into it. Balance. I know you were doing it a lot. Because like when I was a runner, I ran every day. So I would do, even after I retired from competition, I was a coach to professional triathletes, so I'd ride with them sometimes.

1:51:57 So I did triathlon for a couple of years, seek it on a daily basis. And so I couldn't just go cold turkey. So I wound up coaching And the bike riding on the sand, it's interesting. As you get older, you know, your loss of aerobic capacity doesn't drop off as much as your loss of strength and muscle and power. So you have to work on the strength, muscle, and power. You have to

1:54:39 and the liver has to keep up with it, and the lungs have to keep up with it. They've atrophied. Because as like on a deltoid raise, you know, as you go up, it gets tougher and tougher and tougher. And you don't need strength at the bottom of it. You need strength that you need to develop at the top of it. So I do that. I love the hex bar for deadlifts.

1:56:35 I want to prevent injuries. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. different planes anyway yeah yeah so i found out to me at least what i like to do martial arts it's Full range of motion too. the more I keep my back strong. strain i look at my recovery in the morning that's big and i'll see uh what my actual sleep was what At some point, I wonder how much of that you already know.

2:00:17 Right. I really loved – there's a strap that we were using once for Sober October called MyZones, MyZones Fitness Tracker. Okay. I mean, I don't need it. What one were you using? So I've been into this thing for a long time, way before Polar Electro came out with their stuff. So for the month, had a score up today. And it shows the numbers that they're putting up so it's just it's forced it's for like you can say i got

2:03:37 which is a good thing. Which one was Nick? but at some point that's still an addiction. It's still something that's not, Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And my friend says, shit, I got 6,000 more steps. It fits all of the metrics that you suggested we need to do. You asked at some point, you know, am I... Jesus, I had an amazing pasta at Carbone, draconian about this. Let's set the body

2:06:36 it would have screwed everything up. First of all, I would have felt like Yeah. And I see, fuck it. say, because I say, well, I live on my own stored body fat for most of my day. And well, you don't Living too. to find a way to dispose of those calories. So those are calories that I did not need, Enough to keep you going. They're like, liver, you just reserve the ketones for the brain.

2:10:45 than it needs, and it's spilling them out into the urine and the breath, and they're in the but he's making ketones. I see you get the element stuff out there in your thing, Over 0.5 you're in ketosis according to the medical literature. But again, the idea is I talk about it as a closed loop in the book. What's going to happen to me? And then an amazing thing happens where one of the reactions to the body's upregulation

2:14:14 you have enough protein to do that without yeah, we'll keep hunting. And again, this is how the human body evolves. This is how we all have While you're doing that, the brain's just cruising along at, you know, one, one and a half, two times normal output. It's their sweating and fretting and walking around and pacing and all the shit that they're doing.

2:15:53 Because I looked it up at one point. I'm just going to spit out a couple of grams of ketones every hour for the brain, your good brain. I can't imagine a situation where it's going to use a lot unless you've got some organic condition that's wrong with you where it's going to use three times that, probably not use twice that. about and from Yep. Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers

2:18:15 reason for the high caloric burn is due to breathing rates, which tripled during competition, And that's all fat. like a three-hour conversation like this, But the effects of epinephrine, the effects of all of the stress hormones and all the on the couch, and your body just goes into a hibernation. caloric deficit or a recovery deficit? It's both. It's a caloric deficit because if you keep burning,

2:20:52 no more calories to be expended today? it was a stressful life. That may be why I over-trained. You know, I didn't get my, I did Right. I mean, we talk about the Tour de France. I don't know. I basically wrote the anti-doping rules for triathlon It's what EPO is. Of course, then what they would do is even if you didn't have asthma, you would apply for a TUE, a therapeutic use exemption for those guys. Of course, then what they would do is even if you didn't have asthma,

2:24:07 Yeah. ways to do it right. There's a lot of people out there who can, you know, there's lots of ways to screw it up, but there's a lot of ways to do it right. You know, I have two kids and I have a grandchild now, so I get all this stuff. So, yeah, it's scary. I mean, you know, science is tech and science and, you know, this whole thing is really interesting.

2:26:06 It's scary when you look at it Yeah. We know what they did in the Beijing Olympics, and if that's the case, God bless them. No, you haven't. stepped in shit in the world And then he was going to return the next year doping and film a documentary about it. That's how you say his name? Yeah. Gets caught up in this whole thing where they bust these people that are cheating in the Sochi Olympics,

2:28:40 Which just makes you think, like, what is China doing right now? Eugenics. Even Mike Baker could be cousins. some sort of a way. See if we can give up But on the other hand, we literally might be reengineering the species. and then that gap will be even wider by the time it trickles down to regular folks. How do I feel that day? And if I don't feel like training that day, I don't train. And that's a

2:31:31 And so my routine is pretty much around 530 or 6 at night, because I want to do this before dinnertime. but 195 Other times I'll just do, say, three, three and a half minutes, and then just stay shivery for the next hour and get that brown fat going. Yeah. Probably not so much. I mean, there probably are some recovery aspects for me, but that's not why I do it. I do it for the relaxation and sort of for the mental challenge of it a little bit. It

2:33:49 So I would go from the sauna right into the pool, but one time I almost didn't make it As I was moving, I was like, oh, no. And I was like, my arms might not work either. I mean, that happened to me. and so it can get down way below the ambient air temperature and even below the ground temperature around it if a cold Santa Ana is blowing. I don't think I would have made it out.

2:36:13 this vibrating ball. Have you used those? Oh my God, that thing's amazing. I was a little skeptical. um there's a mental discipline involved in it because the last 10 minutes it's just concentrating on just I'm so scared when I do this. extra breaths every time I don't let myself move around and I don't let myself move only thing that'll make me stay still.

2:39:11 it's like you're you're being weak you got to stay put and stay calm and so then i applied that I count the drips off my little fingers. Your phone will die in the sauna, But the last 10 minutes, you can't pay attention to the book. They'll get back out after two seconds. And then they're, like, impressed with themselves, like, you know, crazy. one of the reasons why you moved to this place, because of these? Yeah, so we lived in Miami

2:41:35 Yeah. elevator walk the dog three times a day and he has to shit and you never know. What are you doing? Do you go anywhere else in Florida other than Miami? We, you know, I've got, I keep, I have friends, No, that's Fisher Island It's an enclave and Russian oligarchs right? Oh. Oh, that's weird. All day long. they do indeed I'm like I don't know family back in California

2:44:38 So, you know, the shutters in Santa Monica. lots of drug use and alcoholism. and give them an opportunity to get back on their feet He's like, there's a problem here that you're not going to fix by providing them with goods and services. Yeah. You don't. Does that fix anything? impact statement that takes five years to do, right? So I don't see, I just don't see who is out there in the wings that can turn this around.

2:47:42 I mean, it doesn't get discussed. Correct. fucking jumping off the top of the building doing crazy stunts and shit back there um so we were who turned up missing at the Cecil Hotel And they put all the places where they can get food and shelter in that area. But they're doing it. give you X amount of money you got it you know not camp here and so they'll do

2:50:50 It's not good, Mark. Anything else you want to tell people? It really is great stuff. It's great to see you again.