Joe Rogan Experience #1670 — David Sinclair Transcript

Transcript

0:00 The Joe Rogan Experience. I enjoyed you on the Lex Friedman Podcast. He's both a martial artist and an AI scientist. He's a weird combination of the two things. Oh, Lex will fuck you up. That's one of my goals now. I eat the the good woman thing is God the good man good woman thing Right. You have a friend. you'd have a million women after you joe no i i think um i think emojis are fun jamie thinks

3:39 levels of the game you must learn this new language and this language is an image-based and they'll know what we're talking about. just think how quickly people adapted to cell phone use. In the 1990s, no one had a cell phone. Well, it's similar to the turn of the 19th to the 20th century where all these gadgets showed up Correct me if I'm wrong. Cap.

5:41 It means you're lying. mean? I don't know. That's the part I don't know. something new that's popped up that i've seen a few people be asking like what does that mean We can watch a new language evolve and then they'll start doing this thing, and then that thing becomes like eggplants. you said that like it was years ago that you said that that picture we pulled up

7:32 I think so. Well, and for your study, for the study of human life extension and anti-aging, when you look at the stresses that are completely, they're very novel to the human experience. Really? We don't have to. treadmill where we are today. Innovation after innovation, tool after tool after tool. But in And those things that got us here, there are actually four traits that I can think of that got us here that make us different from all other animals.

9:49 We've got hands that have evolved to throw rocks, shoes. Have you ever seen what it looks like when those guys in the Amazon walk around with So they're gripping the ground. How do you say that? that don't really fit human feet and then they get these weird bunions where their toes are Let's say a house cat. But that's because we've had these tools for so many years.

12:02 But I live in Boston. is to get us out be older for longer. I mean, be healthier in your 80s and 90s. Like my dad, who's turning 82, who's got the physique The other thing is, which I do, is to skip meals. don't know why we don't all do that. I just think we just like to sit around and eat. which taxes your resources? Or is there some sort of a mechanism that leads to decay of the human

15:27 you how old you are really, but then using real science tell you how to slow that down. which will come out later, probably this year, is how do you know what you're doing is working? the people who are doing all of this stuff are the really rich people. And most people either don't know and then they drop it and raise it. at the ends of chromosomes which shorten over time, the telomeres, and actually got longer

18:37 I would say that it's not that controversial, get shorter when cells divide not all cells divide your brain doesn't divide right not typically and good. Should I complete the 60 sessions of the hyperbaric chamber first? Okay, let's do it. All right. Sounds good. Should I complete the 60 So it's Dr. Sinclair, Yeah. Find out how fast you're aging. number, like your credit score. You can look at things like, did you pay your electricity bill?

21:27 What's the things you can inject into yourself? So I know you want to know what they are. And the clock went back by years. All right. First of all, the difference is tiny. Science speak. Or a hockey stick, rather. performance. But it's also worse than that. It's been misinterpreted. This is the bane of my right imagine when you're just like literally trying to be one half of a footstep ahead of your competition five percent means everything yeah but I'm not saying I'm not speaking here to professional athletes necessarily but there's another there's a third misconception isn't it it's crazy how this stuff becomes memes turns out that the reason it that the exercise doesn't build as much muscle is that you just get a little bit tired when you do the reps.

25:03 anything, but I take this molecule NMN, which raises NAD, which we've shown in my lab and others, that it boosts mitochondrial activity, gives more energy, ATP, in animals. But this controversy is way overblown as you can tell. or your ability to have exercise. I didn't tell people why metformin works. It binds to this protein that makes chemical energy.

26:50 that's why it works for type two diabetics. But by accident, this drug has been shown in tens of It's anti-inflammatory as well. That's insane. So what's going on with metformin? Okay. All right. Now we're swimming around. Oh, Mike and Ike's. I'm glad you asked. through that hole, it's like a propeller, like a hydroelectric generator on a dam. And they shoot

30:31 So we've got a leak in the dam. And so not all the energy is going through. So what we see happen And those women were really skinny. So then it became sold. because they wanted to get thin really quickly, Oh, not that many, but still, one is too many. Well, actually, the chemists are working and have made molecules that are sensitive to this acidity.

32:37 We nerf too many corners. It's a tradeoff. So let me tell you some of those other traits that make us different from animals. also been the greatest thing on the earth because we left Africa. They're actually still in us. out of the crap that we've built into society from previous technologies. I'm going to do sauna and ice baths every day because it increases hormesis and it maximizes

35:53 and then one veers off two degrees over time, and then use science to correct it. Maybe you've been partying too much or what have you or studying too late. You can send it in. So maybe you have some bad habits. Maybe you've been partying And I want people to, not just you and me, but everybody to have a sense of their own wellness. And they showed that the twins who lead very different lifestyles,

37:33 What we're talking about today and with what I hope I'll make democratized will get us beyond that. Oh, and don't smoke. If you have this one meal a day, why is it better to do that than to have, say, you know, smaller meals of like 500 calories multiple times per day, We call them longevity genes. Kids are different. forth and multiply and screw my long-term survival. So this is all about long-term survival by making

40:43 and I used to just like eat whenever. Hilarious comedian? So what's your average day look like? And I generally feel like my workouts are so strenuous that I need some sort of nutrition afterwards. me like my workouts are very hard so after them i feel like i need something you know i just i Perfect. Looking forward to meeting him. which, as I mentioned, speeds up metabolisms, does a lot of stuff, those mice could run 50% further.

44:06 Oh, don't get me in trouble. But we've done hundreds of people now, certainly dozens, over the last few years. less and actually also degrades it more. So if you take my skin or in the study that they took heart disease when we're young or Alzheimer's because our bodies fight the way they're advertised. But the theory is that you'll have the same effect. I don't know

47:00 wouldn't go away. And this happens fairly frequently to people who don't stand up. So I now have a standing desk. That's another good tip. But I went out to California found that something was different I was kind of skipping in my walk and I thought it's gone after Well, dry needling does do something to muscles. They basically take acupuncture needles and they stick them in your muscles.

49:08 if you're standing here like this I've got all these fucking weird imbalances in my body. It was amazing. And this doctor I have huge respect for. It's rough. you're like whoa. It gets rough. patients with cancer going through chemotherapy. It's not just a long time to sit still. and then went through the whole bag in 10 minutes. Pro tip. And in conjunction with an IV vitamin drip, it's really, it's a nice effect.

53:39 disruption of this cycle of NAD going up and down in your body. And so I've been using NMN, this supplement, People who travel with me go, Exactly. That'll raise your NAD levels. but this is not just, oh, Dr. Sinclair thinks that this is likely to happen. It's knowing that there are proteins That's a big part of your body's ability to recover and recuperate.

56:09 I can feel it. you do accelerate your aging clock. Give them diabetes. And the whole day for me is a thrill. And then if that doesn't work, then I nibble on an Ambien, It's that. Yeah. And is it just because you're so excited and you're so busy and then you just couldn't wind down? myself not thinking like I'm not by myself but you know I'm just I'm not engaged in anything I'm just

59:22 And here's what I screwed up, damn it. You have to make sure you don't do it at night, though. I'm relaxing. You need to – I got to go, hey, hey, hey. Yeah. Breathing is really important. Yeah. Even during the day when you're starting to freak out or just get too busy, concentrate by the time i look down like oh my god, oh, my God, it's already 25 minutes.

1:02:03 Let me see. Yeah, I did that at Gabby Reese's place recently, too. Right, those two know hormesis. They exponential it. But I was almost thrown up. I had to leave and come back. Had a cold shower and an ice bath. I looked like that girl from Willy Wonka's. They're super athletes, right? but he broke his ankle and just didn't do anything about it. But that's just insane mental strength

1:04:08 Well, it's certainly motivational to jump high to get a breath. I think it was about 10 pounds. on the second lap. He does a lot of Ironmans. Then what they do is, once you've done that, So you have to get... The only way to get air is to jump with these weights out of the water And you do any kind of pool exercises or pool workouts other than that?

1:06:42 stupid but i always think about magnum P.I. Remember the TV show? But I know people can do that. You can tell your body what to do. That's huge. Metformin? Well, he's like one of these mice in our lab that runs further. unfortunately. So you've got to take some risks. And the older you get, the more risk you should He has not and he looks fucking fantastic.

1:09:59 probably some other work that he's had done, but it can make a huge difference how you live your life. That's the goal of me now is to say, don't wait because you don't want to waste away or become an, Well, so I know a little bit about this because I have some friends who are that old. better to start early because you're going to have the biggest bang for the buck.

1:11:57 You've got your longevity genes activated. They're going to know in 20, 30 years what I'm saying is true or not, but we can't wait that of effort. And skipping breakfast was the easiest thing to avoid that, getting overweight. If I could skip one meal, it would be breakfast. that that really doesn't make sense, right? Well, for kids, it's been shown that you do need a bit of food to

1:15:01 hungry. You're not really hungry. But like, if I'll go through the cabinets and I'll see some chips, I'll go, Well, you know, our brain is designed or evolved to crave energy. Our limbic system that you and Elon talked about, the core really sit down and plan your meals twizzlers a friend of mine put me onto them, unfortunately. Rice cakes and rice in general will spike your blood sugar

1:17:49 Can I see it? Potatoes weren't that bad, actually. No. reduces the GI by 30% to 40%. Resistant starch, try cooking rice, potatoes, beans, and pasta a day in advance and cool in the refrigerator overnight. I assume we're not talking about French fries, though. I don't think they're good for you, though. Oh, McDonald's are barely fries, man. Yeah. never had it right it's a goddamn sensational chicken. We need to have a pill that you eat before that

1:21:58 Yes. I assume. Depends. Uh, after about 11, I don't have more caffeine cause then I won't sleep. Yeah. I saw it advertised on Bridget Phetasy Show on Dumpster Fire. She told me to try and make humanity better. quit smoking he would just bring a cigarette everywhere and he would just hold on to it and eat right they must put something in their mouth. They must smoke. They must hold on to something.

1:24:52 But it doesn't really smoke, right? There must be something. It wasn't Google-able really, but it's very strange. So she's sticking it in there. So maybe it's a way to... One thing I'm curious about is why is it the mouth? Maybe nipples from the time you're babies? Yeah, for sure. They like to get head rushed. to be able to help cure things like, Yeah.

1:28:02 Oh, sure. It's an exciting time for brain research, actually, and for the patients, because there So since we last spoke, we published a paper in the journal Nature in December that showed we could not just accelerate aging, but now we can reprogram cells to make them. we do to mice, it's easy. In humans, people get that all the time if they have macular degeneration or need gene therapy to correct their genetic defect in their eye.

1:29:48 talking about with the cheek swab. We now have the ability to turn that clock back and it looks like We know that the proteins in the cell that alter the clock are necessary for the vision to come back. and of course it's bundled up very tightly and how it's bundled up But literally what it is, is we take their DNA out of each cell. Each cell has about six feet of DNA.

1:31:16 the cell is playing a cacophony and no one wants to listen. And it messes up the cell's ability literally we're skipping genes reading when we get older and our treatment is We're going to be testing it on— one little step up yeah so then we'll hopefully have fda approval to go into our first patients We need a way to turn it on and off for safety reasons.

1:33:34 from staph infections and then taking antibiotics. Yeah, it's brand new science. those off in the brain it's similar to when this australian barry marshall discovered that Yep. That's what scientists should be all about. we'll make drugs, and hopefully we'll be saving lives. One of the things I really like about It's actual. It's all right. Right. Not good?

1:37:30 So it got us to this point. We needed stories because we didn't have written words initially. You and I, we spend, I think, half of our lives trying to figure out Like, yeah, once you figured out a way to communicate, tell you that, I don't know, I'm going to be your best friend and I'm going to screw you, really. But these also are the traits Why shouldn't I do that?

1:40:06 What's a different format? Yeah. I'll let you know. When do you take? Please don't write to me, please. that I think a lot of people could benefit from. And you understand things that are super important had this platform to come and speak to you. Before that, we were speaking through reporters, changed pretty radically since the internet. It's one of the few things that I think true

1:43:40 like, did you hear David Sinclair says he's living forever? And then next thing you know, Oh, that's huge. You can't trust anything. all, I said, no, he doesn't have prostate cancer, never had it. He goes, okay, well, And, you know, I think we all have a family history of aging. So let's treat it. Let's try to prevent it. And, you know, I think that we

1:46:18 Will old ladies look hot again? I used to be in the backwater biology 20, 30 years ago, 25 years ago. Can we make old ladies look young again? What's his email? back to peak form in their prime absolutely Wow we are tool makers we are And that's just an example. We can engineer ourselves either through medicine or through even genetically changing our species so that we don't

1:49:32 eating less, you will be literally younger based on that clock, and you will have a much better chance of surviving COVID. If you're obese and you don't exercise, we saw those were the most technology is. There's a third technology, which is we could engineer our genes. Our children could of antibodies that recognize certain proteins, like the spike protein on the outside of COVID-19

1:51:48 foods. Is there a way that you can anticipate where one day we'll be able to give someone a test and say, oh, your ancestors thrived on these particular types of foods and these are And they're like, I dreamed it into reality. from you chewing peanuts can get them deathly ill. differently. I have a different microbiome in my gut than anyone else on the planet.

1:54:21 Wow. which we can measure. This has got to be a very rewarding career path for you Are Australians happy generally? So I'm wired not to get a big ego. Oh, that's what it is. substantial increase in overpopulation? No. No? How come? Well, even in the US now, literally on the ground, were saying, predicted. Bill Gates talks about this wonderfully on YouTube. Please check it out if you haven't

1:58:34 that we need to solve as well. That's directly related to the amount of phthalates that we find in their body, which come from environmental toxins, primarily from plastics. the size of the taint which is really crazy because taints And it's only really been studied to the extent where she's describing it in these peer-reviewed I don't microwave plastics anymore for that very reason.

2:01:55 The big muscles actually tell your testes to make more testosterone. that that'll help me maintain strength around my core. if someone said, all right, I just want to do one thing, I might say kettlebell swings. i do light kettlebells like 35 pound kettlebell swings yeah great i just can't tell you how much And I've never felt better. Right. Well, I think it's the combination because I'm a scientist,

2:05:15 But I think that through what I'm doing and through mind exercises and just running a marathon in my mind, figuratively speaking, every day, I am smarter than I used to be. accident. That's not a coincidence. It's just, that's who I was. And I think that's not an accident. I think definitely mentally this is the smartest I've ever been. Fair enough. I mean, you've had a harder physical life than I have. But my point is that our brains

2:06:50 I dyed it, but I don't have gray. How about you get frosted tips? Yeah. Is that genetic? to tell you know people in Botox anywhere right but if you I've got What the hell's happening there? You can change careers. Is that your own term? and I think also as you get older, there's something that happens to people as you live your life, hopefully, where you keep making mistakes, but you make less of the same mistakes.

2:10:32 Well, you need reflection. and listening to this, I can tell you, you guaranteed that when you're our age at 50, It's like you can learn from their mistakes without having to make the same mistakes. Like you really can. You don't And then for me, it was like that drug fucks you up. And so I learned from other people's mistakes. that targets old people disproportionately, and then unfortunately what happened in places like

2:13:31 everybody else around her like she could have lived a few extra years and enjoyed her family and people that have a difficult time with stress Let's learn something from this. all I'm saying. It's a decision. It's just not good for you. It's not hating on a person's state. And listen, I easily could be a you know I've been in situations where I gained weight and not even that much.

2:16:42 the beginning of the the pandemic she's like well well, what's the thing that fucks you up the most if you're fat? My body feels better. or at least mimic that. And so the fasting and cold therapy is what we've evolved and what our bodies need to be in tip-top shape. Half a pound a day, eventually you'll be nothing. or something that cools you off? I don't know. I don if jamie you can find that we'll have to ask i was using one of those uh mattress covers for a while in la and uh i liked it but i i fucked up a

2:19:14 in it and the tubes have water You can change, you can make it hot if you want, if you'd like to go the other way. Interesting. But do they have a mattress or is it just a cover? Oh, okay. I did a show last night at Vulcan Gas company, and then we went to Golden Tiger Or a ring? yeah and i think if you lie down and it's still in your stomach i'm guessing gravity just barely

2:21:54 It's fuck it juice, right? Well, you've got to live. Yeah, there was a great podcast that I did recently with Ethan Suplee. He's like this big, like muscular, healthy guy. cut you know and removed and then he gained a hundred pounds so he goes back People are crazy. done, with what many people that I know have done. And I think you'll also have the knowledge that you are capable of great feats, that you can do this great thing.

2:25:14 does your biological clock go yes and I would suspect it has a big difference on Yeah. that Penn Jillette has lost a lot of weight You should eat something. You lost too much weight your heads too big for your body now. Yeah those saddest things it does sound horrible yeah uh well yeah that that that's that's the issue that clear Joe that that when I talk about adversity and stress on the body

2:28:15 So is the difference that cortisol is released by the body under situations of uncontrollable stress or situations where things are unmanageable and taking your mind to the next level, herbicides on plants and they kept diluting them down and everyone thinks the less you have less you have the less it'll work but the plants they got the really low color in them, have been stressed,

2:30:51 plants, they'll turn bluish or reddish if they're green. And that's their way of resisting UV. force yourself to do it, in the beginning beginning you'll still be stressed out it'll be cleaner perspective on things. I think people, it's entirely too easy and when they don't happen, and you're a brat, you know, like, you've had a very difficult life on the farm,

2:34:25 as that. I would have a bad day at work and I'd come home. How was your day? Everyone would ask If you have a purpose in life, you live longer. the company relies on you you're a big asset to the company and then you're like shit i really I started my career when I was four years old. How did she say it? I asked her, excuse my language. Yeah. You really do think it's a gene?

2:36:58 It's not gonna be pretty and as a four-year-old that that really freaks you out and that was a turning point in my life Wow. here if i talk too much about her but she didn't want to talk about the small stuff she didn't care She fled Europe, and's a rebel. Wow. And then she got to Australia. She fled Europe. part of human nature through genocide and war that she comes out of it the other end determined to only concentrate on

2:39:51 It's not about the economy. fell down and was in the backyard and by the time they found her she had been there for quite a And she was just an interesting lady. and when I was doing that um I just got to see firsthand like really clearly like this life and stay with him and my grandmother, and I'm watching her die. you don't want regrets you don't want any regrets that's right and we're all gonna die one day yeah

2:43:38 You got to keep going and you got to learn and honor your mistakes and who you were and feel that pain and recognize that the entire journey it's going in a completely different direction now you're a way better person this is one of the things that i concentrate on probably more than anything in my life it's these four traits that that i think make us different that got us in there in this place in the first place and we are

2:46:25 But, yeah, I'm getting better at it. Because if you've gone through difficult things, especially self-imposed difficulties, Yeah. Blowing hard. Uh-huh. That flew past. We just used up three hours of our lives. I'm in. Beautiful. I appreciate you too, Joe.