Joe Rogan Experience #1893 — Will Harris Transcript

Transcript

0:00 Joe Rogan Podcast, check it out! So people see the name Will Harris. discuss, but they only gave you a couple of minutes. And it was really hard because you No. So I sat down and wrote up a four-minute explanation of facts of why I thought that's not good. it's favors people if we'd been in the cow pasture I'd have pinched his fucking head off Good.

3:37 came there in 1866 and established the farm and ran it all his life, followed by his son, them on the farm in a USDA-inspected processing plant I built. We pasture-raise five red meat as a very linear, monocultural cattle operation, the factory farm model. Now it's regenerative and makes us resilient. better and better. And it serves to restart the cycles of nature,

7:02 And I operated the farm very industrially. By industrially, I mean I use a lot of technology. you've got to talk to somebody else. In the industrial model, it's very, very commonly used. It's a multi-million or billion-dollar industry. Wow. Is that commonly used? Yeah. In the industrial model, it's very, very commonly used. they're not accustomed to it. It's a little chewier. It's a little different.

8:59 if that was your body, you'd be like, wow, I might need to get myself together It would weigh, live weight 1,100 pounds. It would have two or three They would be probably 16 to 18 months of age, not two years. That's my bet. During the pandemic panic, when the packing plants were closed down, they were euthanizing chickens and hogs particularly because they couldn't slaughter them, so they euthanized them.

11:28 I mean, we would have just kept accumulating animals in the pasture until I could open my packing plant back up. animals that live in We're just going to kill them all. Okay. You don't intentionally inflict pain and suffering on the animal, and you're good to go. Cows are meant to roam and graze. You give them all the Cheetos and Oreos and Fritos they want,

15:10 I was a monocultural cattleman at that time. And what's the benefit of that? nutritional perspective, if you Yeah, it's disgusting. So one of the horrors of animal agriculture was the great – the moment in England and in Europe where there's mad cow disease spread through the land. you convey it to healthy animals. is the misapplication of technology.

18:52 and they're undesirable consequences. Okay. And I'll give you some examples. figured out that, What is in ammoniated fertilizer that's different from regular fertilizer? Good point. That's where batshit crazy comes from, apparently. that bat shit was so valuable that people would fight for bat shit. So it's in super large doses that would normally not exist in compost or manure or any things like that.

22:57 So my dad told me that in—he was born in 1920, so 1946, he'd been 26 years old and then come back. Now, the benefit was so obvious. It killed the microbes in the soil, not sterilized them, So it was invented in World War II. Yeah. soil texture, soil chemistry. We never talked about soil biology. And when did they figure that out, that it's actually, that there's soil biology, and that you have to manage that,

26:48 You know, I guess the organic vegetable movement was probably the first harbinger of that in probably the 70s. It's hard to get off of a crutch. No sides. And I can remember hearing a long time It's a hell of a deal. And my thought was like, why are you making apologies for that? Let me bring that home for you from a practitioner's perspective. I don't really know.

30:31 They speculate it came up here in bird droppings. But it's not a good plant because it literally dominates the landscape. I could give it a breath of Roundup and it would die. Could you grit it off and do it by hand? So I have bought, or actually she gave them to me. Whoa, they're cool looking. So all it does is eat soda leaves. Which I want. overwinter on my farm.

33:58 How many species have gone extinct? is equally bad. I could very easily wind up with a 3,200-acre monoculture of tropical salt apple on my farm, which is equally flying in the face of nature. just like i intentionally brought in the the there it is just covers everything it is destroyed Really? It's actually quite point where it was't that last photograph,

36:37 I give you my word. The big question about regenerative farming for most people is, to feed 18 million people that don't farm. Or do we need a certain amount of factory farming in order for people to live like that have 18 million people. Right. They are – they got degrees from – And you're the only farm that lives the way yours is? Don't forget that question.

39:19 He got all the time in the world, sir. But first, let's stipulate that the earth has a carrying capacity. It's beautiful. the question is, what farming method will What if it's oil? What if it's the dead zone in the Gulf of Mexico down there, right? And what kind of feed do you bring in? factory farming system, how much more money would it cost and how much more money would you get out

43:11 but you don't get as much weight out of them. That is so situational. is probably Now, let's step over to poultry. We took more cost out of production. as a farmer to give up all the tools that reductionist Like if you believe in climate change, and I do, how much is a good hurricane cost? that are doing it in the industrialized way Nobody's looking at the factory farming system going, oh, wow, you stuff all those pigs together.

47:07 That's what scares people. You know, big food, big ag, they may be evil. Well, they don't see anything wrong with it. So that's number one. Not a damn thing. So that's one reason they're just so heavily invested. Their family's been running it forever. So let's compare my business to a commodity farmer, a larger commodity farmer. My business is high risk.

50:50 When you've got crop insurance to mitigate risk, the cotton gins and the cotton pickers and all the different things that they need, that What you said is there's a way to get us all we need farming that way. definitely do. If cotton Well, you know, if cotton was $15 a pound, you'd probably have less T-shirts. today is that we briefly mentioned earlier.

54:04 They probably should. Probably should. But in the industrial model that we operate in, The farmer doesn't have to have $20-something million worth of assets like we do to further Okay. Well, that's assuming that's it and that's So it's... What is that number? Yeah. Because most of what we grow today for corn either goes into corn syrup or it goes into animal feed. That's a lot

58:30 So those are two things that are abundant because of the fact the dominant crop it is, because it lends itself so well to these outside inputs. Nothing wrong with that. having farms run regeneratively like yours? Like if someone wants to continue with that We'll become far No. Savory Institute. Savory Institute. And Savory International is a group that is devoted to that. And my farm is a savory hub.

1:02:01 So, and we can talk more about that, but the main point I want to make is in the savory thought process, we talk about the difference in a complex system and a complicated system. it don't work no more. And reductionist science In that scenario, it doesn't lend itself to reductive science as well because of the unintended consequences, that morphing we're talking about.

1:04:24 They're not super scalable. using the factory First, let me tell you that industrial farming breaks the cycles of nature. we ceased to produce that abundance, that one plus one is three, And we're able to restart the cycles of nature. Okay. Make Spencer shut up if you don't mind. So what is in that water that's causing it to be that color? So a lot of that several hundred pounds of chemical fertilizer is in that water as well.

1:08:59 If it was a construction site, you'd be in trouble. Like literally, no pun intended. Bay, to the So Apalachicola Bay used to be famous for its oysters, I'll say one more word about that. So not only is the quality way different, but the quantity. You can look on my website, whiteoakpastures.com, under the Land Stewardship tab, and back out. event. if it comes

1:12:41 in my That's a function of industrial farming. It seems like— 20 years. 20 years for it to be where it's at now. Correct. And so how long did it take for you to do that? It seems like- Wow. You do. especially when you're talking about like your neighbor who's only got 200 acres and you know Is there a way to do that to turn farms into more self-sustaining the way yours is?

1:15:34 Big Ag and Big Food decide what they want, and then they hire lobbyists, And I think that there's a, I can give you some examples actually, but I think there's a culture of catering to big ag and big food because of the rewards that come post-retirement. We put poultry on the ground. poultry. Wow. How many Were they eating any of them? Oh yeah. pure and beautiful.

1:18:41 Let me tell you that in a minute. So I went to my local USDA office, and they told me what to do to prove my losses. And I went through the National Appeals Division. Oh, no. I think that's what it is, or do you think they just don't want to give money away? Oh, no. A brilliant poultry manager of ours... I wish I could tell you this was my idea, And they do a fantastic job protecting my poultry from mammal predators.

1:22:19 So our poultry manager, it took him a couple of years to get it worked out, but he did. We started putting up electric netting way around the area that the birds were. I like that perspective. So it's the dogs. Yeah. are vegetarian or vegan, whatever you like. You can choose your religion. animal. won't eat animals because they're destroying you that my farm

1:25:11 weighs about two million pounds. Per acre. and turned it into fat and protein and carbohydrate. That is the plant. burping or whatever. And a lot of it went Bingo. So it's not just raising animals. Like that shouldn't be okay. That was gypsum board. Europeans got here, but I'm not going to put the animal impact in it. the way it normally naturally would.

1:29:22 to you showed that we And so they just repeat it over and over again. But obviously, when talking to someone like you, who's an actual farmer, and don't think at all about where that cow came from This is fairly recent in human history. And you see everybody in a separate discipline. Yeah. Makes sense. a guy named Dr. Jason Roundtree. Industry. model is

1:34:25 You can't write a how-to manual on operating Joe Rogan's body I don't know if the change is going to come or not, because, it won't come from Cheap and fast. Those guys then and me now are focused on, the industrialization was hell on the land and the water and the environment. And then the last one is commoditization. And the town has gone from, during that period, being a ghost town, literally, to a little destination.

1:39:24 got a restaurant, we got got cabins for lodging, we've got an RV park, we've got a restaurant, we've Wow. So obviously you're having a positive impact on the community. If I can't find it, we won't worry about it. 80% of the people are employed by us. And most of the rest of them probably don't work. Some do, That's pretty nice. So obviously you have a lot of employees and you have a positive impact on the community.

1:42:47 food? Who knows that? It's not good. Like I don't eat that stuff very often. If I knew that we were creating more regenerative farms and more people were doing things more naturally. Right. I had him on the podcast back in the day, I am a deliriously happy person. But I see a lot of frustrated, in me and them is, my management team talk about it a lot. I cannot tell you if I am a niche provider

1:46:36 I go to bed at night over saving You help by doing what you're doing, actually. And that's my part towards saving the world. White Oak Passage is the center. Yeah. has been primarily but the people like Bill Gates, And I don't have that to say. So this complex issue of a technocrat using technology as the only tool, this is what you have an issue with.

1:51:18 And you're saying, no, it's not. if we have not just carbon neutral but carbon negative, It's not impossible to imagine someone like him making that decision. So let me tell you another one. And I talked to you about the cycles of nature. And there's no doubt in my mind that a technocrat can't come up with a machine technology that sucks carbon out of the air.

1:54:06 You think they've made them. agriculture in these urban areas, unless we decided to level buildings and start putting farms up everywhere. It's not as good for you, and this is not a knock on cities. You're breathing nice, clean air every day. You said something earlier where you said you think it's being done intentionally. I do not respect the militant-vegan decision.

1:58:17 on vegetable-based protein. But we're just talking about carbon. And there's money to be pay a lot of money to mitigate their carbon footprint, And then at least in terms of some of these options, it's not healthy. It gives me hope for others who want to follow us and start this kind of agriculture. They don't want vegetable opportunity to do what I do because of it. But don't you think that the less demand than they

2:01:59 You know, I just don't know. pastures in every county in the United And one of them was I want to be more local. and I've got to reach as far as I have to reach to get it. American grass-fed beef 20 years ago. Sort of. Okay. So, greenwashing. What the hell does that mean? So there's no... You're supposed to be Whole Foods. Healthier, better for the environment, low-carbon footprint.

2:06:50 Okay. And it was all about this. And it was explained to us at the time that we want to bring the industry into higher animal welfare, Okay. But as a result, in the case, in the meat case, instead of even though there's five steps you're not Step one, no cages, no crates, no crowding. exactly what the animal was raised for, that range from Step 1 to Step 5+,

2:10:47 So by saying that it includes these 2,451 farms, they're not saying how many of them are actually Step 5. The distribution would be greatly skewed. It's all good. Yeah. You know, prior to the end of World War II, there was no industrial farming. Thank you. They're trying to pretend that most of their meat is gotten from people like you. this is not advertising,

2:14:54 No greenwashing. I ain't much of an ass-kissing business. I get it. So this is a scrotum that's been turned into a bag? Right, the bull does. There you go. There was two in there before. I think this would be very attractive to people that like crystals. So we're very proud of that nutrient stream, that zero waste. We made biodiesel out of the lard and tallow.

2:19:04 We've got a product called Tyler Be Thy Name. That's beautiful. And when I heard that they were doing that, I was a little dismayed by it control. ultimate corporate showing chickens so grazed it. Now you see this grass material laying on top. Probably 70% of it will oxidize and go up into the air and never find, the microbes will never know it was there. It's

2:23:32 Maybe you can get other people to listen. farm. There's so many underserved people that would and the way you're doing it. And, um, it's just nice to know that there is options like that But I think unfortunately most individuals aren't informed of the whole process the way you just described it. The website is whiteoakpastures.com. Random House, and they hired a lady to write the book, and it'll be out.

2:26:32 Thank you.