Joe Rogan Experience #1901 — Steven Pressfield Transcript

Transcript

0:00 The Joe Rogan Experience. Is this your memoir? Yeah, but on the same, along the same vein. Yeah, She is. like you which i think it is yeah she is she is whatever it is that thing where if you show up it wasn't a hard read you know it wasn't a giant book but it was so valuable because it just like You know, like, oh, I don't feel like going up today.

3:25 So this is what I mean. A spot is, say, if you're going to go to the comedy store and on regular There's the main room that seats about 400 plus people. they're like, oh, I don't feel like going up. That's the work that you're talking about. So then you're doing a show. And one of the things that I realized in blog, when I write blog, which is essentially essays,

7:07 And I'll take that, I'll pull it out and I'll copy and paste it in another folder or another file. You need them. It was definitely scary when I first started doing it. It should be really a good time. I mean, In other words, I don't know, man. It's not easy being an EMT. to you. But, Jesus Christ, what a great life. It's because, like, it's just there's a thing that you describe that you just nailed it,

10:50 Let's go to CNN. You know, you're not worthy. But it's really not personal. Like why are people deeper place, right? And even when Jung or Joseph Campbell describe the self, I have a little shift to identify with that greater self, then the ego is out of business. So I think, this is my Or let me distract you. this is my theory, Joe. So I think that the ego produces it. I mean, it's interesting sort of

15:39 They're not thinking about anything, right, when they're hunting or whatever it is. is highly ethical dude. Like when he talks about businesses, startups, and all the things that he's interesting how it's not able to see that it would actually benefit the ego if you didn't have resistance. Yeah. for you to mark this stuff, right? The ego believes that this flesh can be hurt, you know, can be maimed, can be broken,

18:46 Whereas this giant self, in my opinion, That's why so much of the evil that happens in the world comes out of that, right? If the ego thinks that it's living our life, it's calling the shots, it's going to hang on to that, you know, out of fear. So this greater self, what is, if, like, what do you think that is? You're not too old. There's another world that's greater.

22:23 You really can't operate heavy equipment. You really can't handle the stuff you have to handle. You can't do your taxes, living amongst predators and other violent human beings on Earth, It wants to protect us, you know? Did I? Oh, is that what it was? but you're also a comic and you're also a podcaster where you're reaching out into this other to encounter all of these different perspectives and to interact with all these different people that think about the world in a different way. And it makes me, you know, reconsider my own ideas or

26:51 You must wear that. And generally we come up with, when we do Sober October, And then this year we decided what we're was like knowing that you had to do this thing was so different than just going, I probably should work out today. 233 o'clock and so I woke up at 10 as I gotta should work out, but I don't fucking feel like working out do every day that's how you get productive and what we found all of us found is there's this alleviation of anxiety that comes from doing these

30:06 rang out all the tension, just dripped it out. And the fact that you have to do it every day, So instead of seven days a week, I do it five days a week. No ifs, ands, or buts. Yeah, and I think what that is to me is an exercise, like a ritualistic exercise in like a disconnect between what you can do and what you're going to do, what your potential is

33:16 I mean, I don't know if you're, are you familiar with Paramahansa Yogananda's stuff at all? He says, get up, start your day. why. Maybe we're in that greater world, you know, that unconscious. It's only when we come into It also has that aspect of religion where you're all in it together. It's like the military in a way, right? that evolution would favor thoughts that like immediately launch you into action. Yeah, you

36:23 But it just still seems like it doesn't. accomplishing great works of literature and creating comedy and We still have the same thing, but yet we have this other potential. Who do you hope to be? would like to be better at archery I would like to be better at playing pool I'd like to be better I think you may be overly modest here now yes. And you're also exploring kind of inner worlds, your own inner world, you know, with the help of chemicals or whatever it is.

40:10 years ago 15 years ago 20 years ago like I feel like every year I get better at That's what I think. Okay. so I feel like if I had like this And we'd be just like someday man imagine that just being just nothing but a material's ready so we talk like that but i don't i don't ever say like in 10 years i want to be I want to be this, 10 years, I want to be that, because you never know what trolley is coming

44:20 grease thing, you know? But I think as long as you're still following that impetus, but that's how I feel now. What would you have thought then, you think? Of course, Or a book, right? Well, you know, I try to get to the gym more. And then you read the book like holy shit. This is great. Yeah, realize they had a goal build a motorcycle, whatever it is. Because then when you have a project like that, like a book, right?

47:09 You're in your own lane, tapped into something that's coming from you, from your deepest But it is you because you did it, you know, or if you start a business The Legend of Bagger of Hands. You look back at a thing like Bruce Springsteen's albums. And they give you something to concentrate your creative energy on. And I love the way you think about it.

50:26 Just show up and go to work. and put in the work, Yeah, I've heard of that guy. He talks about getting into that world where you are no one and no place So, I mean, but as long as you have a thing that you're concentrating on that you sort of give up your control of the moment to and that you respect enough that you're going to show up every day and put in the work and address this thing.

52:13 the opening invocation of the muse. As Homer himself was sitting, if you look at the first I'll just skip to the end. Those gods and goddesses were real. It's like how much control are you going to give to this idea? Yeah. And I mean, I'm not saying that's true, but it would be who says that this technological, I don't know if you've seen his Netflix series. It's out now. It's really amazing.

57:15 And for the longest time, he, you know, when he wrote the first book, which was Fingerprints of the Gods, he was widely criticized for it and dismissed as being, And those are the floods that were talked about in stories like the Epic of Gilgamesh, Noah's Ark. up there that maybe Well, then why is it that when you do You're like, like wow the universe is

1:00:17 I mean what is it like? So below our level of consciousness. it, to take it seriously, you know, to put it down and then to work with it, you know? So it's, There's a thing that we get out of them that doesn't exist in the animal world. or another have a sense that there's more i think it's an emerging sense and i think this emerging and by getting out of your own way and summoning the muse,

1:04:14 And a lot of that gift is the alleviation of pain, I think, you know, The other hand, I would wonder if, when we go back to primitive people, if they had somehow a deeper understanding or a more direct understanding of God or whatever. I mean, think about all the fear mongering that goes on in the news because if it bleeds, it leads. and was one of the most influential stand-up comedians

1:06:17 He's like, Ted Turner's making all this shit up. And why is there so much poverty? not and we were living in these sort of tribal environments i I think it's more in a line with a natural way Father to son, mother to daughter, whatever. What did they get to? You know, the energy coming up, It's all us versus them. you know, take a shower, get something out of that. The 24-hour news cycle is another horrible thing, you know.

1:10:18 executives, oh, they were ecstatic when they heard that, right? Oh, this will scare the fuck out of Another mass shooting. But they know, you know, it's gold to them. Right. You know? Right. through, you know, all the communities and the cops are after him. And like everything else that's on But isn't that maybe what's emerging, this understanding of the world as a whole?

1:12:02 And, you know, there's also an awareness. And what am I contributing to? earlier today, to a bank group at the Marriott. I mean, what is that? in kindergarten, you know? But if Plato were to walk onto this scene or an ancient Spartan or wanted to join modern civilization, but everyone from modern civilization wanted to be a part of I think it's the way we evolved. And these human reward systems are just sort of ingrained in the fiber of our being.

1:16:21 Well, what is that feeling? and then they release them back into the lake, which is kind of crazy. that with that movie what but you know that react the reality of that that life is so much more buy an island crazy like that's like if you got an island like Tyler Perry has an island oh he's Maybe you get to play golf on the weekend. we're all, I mean, that's a modern way that sort of taps into those ancient needs,

1:20:27 I would imagine the majority of people do not enjoy what they're doing. interesting to me, and it is kind of hopeful to be on some level, Joe, is that there are a lot of and pop people following their dreams, even if they're kind of they're not you know global things about the internet. Then you and the wife have to have a conversation like, is this sustainable?

1:23:27 Yeah. to fuck us up physically, emotionally, psychologically. But if we do let it flow, because there's some people out there that truly don't have interests. They don't have a thing that And she kind of pulls them together somehow. or something like that. Yeah. And it's very valuable. I mean, if you're a person They should come to her house. Yeah.

1:27:36 called the the heyoka and the heyoka their job was to make fun of all the things that were there, whether it was the biggest warrior or the chief or everything. And there was a way of, like, letting out the hot air and, you know, all the windbags and sort of letting them know that, you know, they're kind of full of shit. Yeah. your journey quicker and easier. And maybe you can now impart that to young people that you see

1:29:29 There's no value for me pondering what great things I've done. With my mind and my ego and who I am as a human, how that works, there's no value in that. I think the reason, well, I know i'm not doing bad which is nice but i think the the value is in where where i when i do my best is when i just Like, that's just wasted time. negative. And I've seen people crippled by negative critiques and negative comments and

1:32:11 That when you do something evil to a person that has no effect on you, but that's not true And it's nice when people show up for my shows. And it's nice that the podcast is successful. And so they really hate themselves and they project that outward. really comes on an individual level from that sort of thing, from people that know they have There's a great quote.

1:35:36 That that's the reason why people get shitty. And it seems like when you say an unmet need, that the person is waiting for someone else or some other force to supply their quote-unquote need. You know? But it's just what is going to address that? I'd rather be able to sneak through a restaurant It's all great. making motorcycles, whatever it is, Well, your ego and your perception of yourself and how you're viewed by the world is this, like, fluctuating thing.

1:40:08 music or your writing. brag about it so much it grosses you out. You don't to buy their car like fuck that guy in his car uh-huh like what's wrong with me I can't do that, I have to really understand what that is and why it's coming up and then figure out. And then I assess. You're looking to like – you get in your own way. How? experiences. And then when you come out of them, the idea of bragging or the idea of like dwelling on your accomplishments

1:44:48 They help you see things in a far more introspective, a far clearer perspective, psychedelic. Um, there's, there's much evidence that the ancient Greeks, uh, in fact, uh, Brian It came from these wise people getting together and having these rituals. And that this has now Well, because it was all squashed by the Romans. Ah. Are you interested? Yes. Have you the Hermetics at all? No. Ah.

1:47:55 The Hermetics were Egyptians. The first one is that you and I have no physical existence as entities. believed was that there's no such thing as opposites. into gold. And they had, uh, the other things was, you know, everything vibrates. I think there are many cultures that were tapping into this at some point in time. years ago. And this was the first ever thing that they could date that they know for sure

1:52:33 that they had cut the stone out. because there was probably some really advanced thinking perhaps these people that lived 10,000, 20,000 years ago had already figured out. Yeah. Well, there was a recent discovery. It's really wild because- Yeah. to fire. But that doesn't necessarily mean people were heating food before eating it, says Zohar. Yal...

1:56:34 Yeah. what we know about these civilizations is there was stone seems to have a lot to do with this shit, right? You know, we're talking about, you know, imaginative oh, these previous generations couldn't have known that, and then we finally dig it up, we go, I don't know. Yeah. respond to that so much, you know? Yeah. Yeah. right? There's something, you know, one of them may be be angry one of them may be very peaceful you know

2:01:11 that we don't go through previous lives just as solitary individuals. I believe that we might have like a group of four or five souls that are kind of migrating with us through these lives, reality. And so again, I can't base this on anything other than I'm sort of inspired with got its own North Star that it's going toward, So when you write, this is like a repeating theme that resonates in your mind.

2:03:54 But it also exists throughout human culture for some strange reason. Maybe they really experienced that, you know. It's been around a long time. So why would it bother you if that goes on forever? i guess you're scared of the idea of sort of stasis that it never changes right that you're This is you forever. Is there justice somewhere? There didn't seem to be a lot of negative karma coming his way.

2:08:43 these gods and goddesses that were the fates, you know, and that there were these gods and goddesses I don't know. You're always going to be burdened down by this feeling that you have Let's go. Nobody thinks like that. that as your child. You say something mean to someone, and then they feel bad, then you feel And I feel genuinely like I'm on the right path when I'm more disciplined when I get work done

2:13:22 They have an ethical structure, and they're teaching you how to live your life is savage and evil and selfish and so this it needs to be uh indoctrinated or conditioned or you walk out and you go, oh, boy, that's, you know. And we're aware of both of those things. And one, we admire. We admire the Martin Luther King juniors of the world we But you know what I'm saying?

2:16:15 Where the bet is, you know, if we break this guy Job's balls badly enough, you know, that you could take that allowed you to exist in a physical material world and interact with and that every time you're born, you are picking up where you left off? of people that believe that, that people that are living terrible lives right now, they just get Hopefully.

2:19:26 That's his book. Yeah. And even those who have overcome that, that temptation is always there. I'm going to do the work. David Goggins is probably one of the most disciplined humans that's ever It's great to be a slob. It's great to live in this world. And that's the last thing I'd ever So a strong mind is not just one that can do calculus. The body doesn't want to do it.

2:24:06 toilet bowl, right? So we do it. We go to the gym, we work out, whatever it is, and we get into the they want to watch TV, they eat Ho-Hos and drink Coca-Cola and just don't ever do it. Yeah. soul's expression, whatever that is, which could be, you know, painting lowriders or doing your Nobody else can do it. And there's also a real value in the way you've sort of

2:28:36 Like, this is what I do. Once we confront it, just like you get that third set and you start And I'm sure that's what the Dalai Lama does or any great avatar just, I dismiss you. Absolutely. I mean, it's not fascinating, but it absolutely, it's true. I mean, I'm facing I haven't got enough time, blah, blah, blah. And so I just have to keep reminding myself of that. And then I have my various little tricks to help me, you know, get over it. But it doesn't go away ever. You know, I don't think it ever does

2:31:17 I like them in that I actually do enjoy some aspects of it. oh it's difficult did you ever know ed Giuliani? No. The bodybuilder? When we take vacations, you know, we feel it, right? That's the guy right there? Yeah. Here's my theory on vacations, for whatever it's worth. on the ground. I know I can, then I'll take a vacation. You know, when I know I've sort of got

2:34:19 and then you can take a vacation. So you've got 20 pages, 40 pages, whatever. When I'm writing a special, like if I'm finishing a special, I already have like five or ten minutes for the next special. Ah, that's great. Oh, I didn't know that. So what he's going to do is he's going to tighten that down and edit that down to the very You always got something cooking.

2:36:34 Yeah. But for someone that's, like, in the middle of the creative process, would kind of like fuck with the thing. Yeah, you need a certain amount of real freedom in that regard. No, not for me. But to think about a thing to talk about and to have that thing worthy of an extraordinary amount of time. ground and the transitions i mean it just requires some creativity i don't think it's that hard to

2:40:04 You know, how do you come up with a premise? now I'm like in that period where I'm just constantly searching around. And then once I It's like things have their place and you don't know where that place is until you move them around like you ever It's the way the joke sounds sounds just like a song is not just It's true. even if they're taught by people who aren't that funny,

2:43:41 But if you don't have the spark, you't make a fire and i don't know what that i was like really i was like you think i'm funny like my my sense of humor is only good for psychos I mean, that's not something that your mom and dad say to you unless you're like the class clown. She was worried that I was trying to become a comedian. like to be them you don't know how their mind works and so to give someone advice on i think

2:46:32 is a good way to expose a new idea to somebody because they can absorb it in the privacy of Nobody, they're not embarrassed by that. I appreciate everything you've done. If we haven't exhausted everything that we know. No, we'll do it again. We'll do it again. We'll certainly do it again. But seriously, like I say, if it wasn't for you, the war of art would not