Joe Rogan Experience #2210 — Calley Means & Casey Means, MD Transcript

Transcript

0:00 The Joe Rogan Experience. It's probably a bad way to start off a podcast of how fucked we are. So went to Stanford with Casey. She studied biology money to the NAACP to say that taking Coke off food stamps was racist. Coke, soda today, This is really important for people to understand. of care. And I really did believe that and people believe that.

3:20 industry, there's chronic rates of depression I think there's like pings of consciousness trying to alert us to this, like you having I think it's like Donald Trump. He represents putting finger on something To me, healthcare, what Casey talks about, and they're trying to like lunge out for it, forget the conspiracy theory, every good medical student and resident is supposed to do, climb the academic ranks, publish papers, et cetera. And so I was heads down in that journey. And just like Callie's saying, like with what

6:38 But fundamentally when you pop up for just a second, which they don't want you to do started looking at the data in a different way. And I started to look at what's happening with health trends So early on at dementias we're we're seeing, you know, this one a quarter of the country. And I could go through so many more diseases. is why we had to write a book about it, which is that it's all caused by metabolic dysfunction,

10:04 about this, it's basically like all of us are a little bit dead while we're That's not our job in medicine. connected to nature and we're completely interdependent with nature, and all the issues. be told that there's nothing wrong, nothing to see here while our health and the health drug companies advertising or food companies or any of these things.

13:21 It's a human issue and the fact that people are willing to take money to not talk about one of the biggest problems that we have in Alzheimer's, their entire course load, their entire training, their entire focus is on accepting Alzheimer's that it's there, It's how many people can you see. They go to the primary care doctor with a list of issues lane and not actually step out and look at the big picture of how things are connected

15:35 We've got ADHD through the roof, autism through the roof. Alzheimer's going up. So we've got all these neurodevelopmental issues and neurodegenerative issues sort of They're getting pubic hair. we've got these neuro issues throughout the lifetime all And I think, you know, when you think about some of these things, it's like we're becoming see it. I think in some way we have like totally lost respect for like the miraculousness of life.

18:31 and to awe and to connecting with source But like, if we don't, like, I do think we're on the road we have right now and I think we have to take that very seriously and I think a lot of the political stuff that's happening, Maha, it's all just through puberty way earlier and no one has any idea why. And of course that's because it. But like there have been eight billion metric tons of plastic produced on planet

21:27 There was this recent study that was to estrogen. So atrazine, which is banned in Europe, but we spray 70 million pounds humans and it's all invisible. And again, it's like, how would you even do the study to show that? how are we allowing this to happen? And then of course it's affecting boys too, right? we also have an entire food system that's driving visceral fat to make us more estrogen

24:27 Like, do we need to wait for a double-blind, to wear hazmat suits to spray and kills every single organism in sight. of knowing that the sun is good, I mean, Tufts Nutrition School, 80% of their budget is from food companies. med school, then Stanford med school. So all of them are enforcing this. And then it's Where is that level of rigor around metabolic health for kids, around nutrition for kids?

27:16 being sick profit from us being depressed profit from us being infertile Right? The psychiatrist, the standard of care. not asking if they're being force-fed, ultra-processed food, they're realizing this is a rigged system. Some people, a few people of the face, and then he focused on a fellowship on an even narrower part of the body. solution is truly just having the clinical guidelines of how diseases are assessed and how they're intervened

30:21 It's literally that simple, but it takes that moral courage. Yeah. you think about and it's hard, like this is a primal instinct to not break out of the while I was there to revamp the curriculum. level the medical guidelines that if you step out of, you are at risk for litigation as a doctor, and the I learned how to do surgery. And doctors, it's not a hammer in our toolbox.

34:05 cancer, obesity, mitochondrial dysfunction, infertility, ADHD, liver dysfunction. processes that happen at night. And the way your body knows whether it's day or sleep deprivation for five nights and they become pre-diabetic. of interest to make the things that they learn a specific We all need to use our voices. Being complicit, like what future do we want and what are we willing to do for it?

37:10 this tribe on the other side, you know, that I think we're all in of like promoting health, And team humanity always by extension will be team planet I don't think they were really aware of that until about five or six years ago. is I think a lot of people listening to us years ago, standard today for medical education. And it literally says in the binding

39:34 Some policy, I mean, we can get to policies, but like rescinding the Flexner report and from byproducts of oil production and was the first investor into Johns Hopkins and other major listener can think of was created before that time. You know, it's all acute situations, emergency saw the birth control pill in the late 1950s, 1960s, office. They saw that you could medicalize chronic conditions. Today, 95, 90 to 95 percent

42:28 reversible, that it's basically genetic, heart disease, all these things, and You know, dope mean is a really good thing to sell, which the tech companies do now. And they did two things very, very intentionally. and Archie Reynolds, were the two largest food producers in the United States. Like Again, you can't overeat grass-fed steak, chemicals, these neurotoxins are destroying our cells, destroying our microbiome in ways

45:16 where the burden of proof for harm, They're overwhelmed. One thing that I find really interesting is like that I really reflect on a lot is like, were declassified. They ghost-wrote scientific papers saying that glyphosate is safe. So So we have to get our heads out of our ass and use our common sense and realize what's going on and and and not wait

48:06 Maybe some good intentions there, but then it got there was an opportunity there that got seen Then you go to the 1970s, you feel satiated it makes you more hungry and this is evolutionarily and we knew this. We can add it to salad dressing. Just last thing I'll mention flash forward, 1986, I think another very important date, for for vaccine harm, but you cannot sue the company. So you start to get, you know, no fault reimbursements for, for vaccine harm, but you cannot sue

51:12 Can I just say one thing about the fructose corn syrup? pooing all this stuff like, oh, this is nonsense. Sugar is sugar. Like there's no difference So when fructose is metabolized in the body, overloading the mitochondria with the acid, the ADHD and all that stuff to make the bears manic so they get as much berries as possible. We're never going to have the uric acid increasing and overloading the mitochondria if we're

53:40 Our body has the ability to deal with some heavy metals. That's literally the definition of how a double-blind placebo-controlled study happens. You can't test psychedelics on that way. You can't test food. You can't test exercise. You can't blind those things. So anything that actually recognizes the unison and interconnectivity But what about the 20 that they're getting before 18 months? Like, we don't look at it

55:55 We rely on this. human. I don't need a peer reviewed study or a textbook to tell me how to do that our body and when you when we talked about early puberty. You mentioned escalating risks of Alzheimer's. is at an all-time high, growing at an increasing rate to chronic conditions, which Alzheimer's is, you have to really not ask the Alzheimer's definition don't have type 2 diabetes. You almost have a 0% chance of getting

59:33 to basic lifestyle factors. and frankly how we view the environment? times with healthcare spitting the rate of GDP, it's the largest and fastest point about incrementalism versus radical is the question we need to be but no Alzheimer's drugs really work meaningfully. his book Brain Energy, but like we've somehow decided to separate the brain from the body

1:01:57 that's happening with our increasing diabetes rates. And then the early onset dementia and So this neuro-metabolic, neuro-energetic theory of Alzheimer's, maybe with these cells crying When in fact, actually, if we could unencumber the brain about when you really look at the research, there are about 36 different biomarkers and just got on top of some of the basic modifiable factors of our metabolic health, we could slash Alzheimer's

1:04:23 These are the three hallmarks of metabolic dysfunction. I'll just say, like, there's kind of just a question with all we're hearing about these American history, at least since World War Two. In modern times, There's something that came out very recently see if you can find this Jamie. I think made up data that then has served as foundational dogma for future research. So you think about

1:07:07 so, you know, in each industry, you see people fighting for that, including at the NIH, including Yeah. So the second this bill is signed And I bring these things up, because it's not opening up any money for food or exercise or any other modality and millions of dollars in research grants guidance on that. You can't do that. I go you understand based on the JP Morgan

1:10:48 Right, and of course, you know more than 50% of the people that even have insurance funding for it go off of it within six Ozympec's a short-term so look at me right in the eyes. I'm like no it literally says there's metabolic issues what's happening with obesity, with Alzheimer's, in the room as he starts thinking about it. poisoning ourselves en masse is pretty hard. So there are simple ways to do this. If Dr. Fauci

1:12:55 Seeing that the medical system has co-opted less per capita on health care and two times more talk about that. I think there's a really really important societal dynamic or the insurance industry. Julie Michaels and so many great people, It's like, I don't understand this. Why podcasts, like why your podcast worked out. We want to evangelize this and add the chorus to prevent what's happening because so many

1:16:42 companies and evangelizing and through through these amazing podcasts like Tucker, we got connected with people. So got to know I had like a spiritual, what I can call it, him in Austin at a campaign event six months before and I just I just had this strong vision of of him standing with Trump and how what So that was all the context. because that moment felt very heavy after the assassination.

1:19:06 we have such obese children in the United States, about why we have a fertility crisis. watching him care about this issue watching what's happening institutional capture that's going to destroy our country, I think to an Who is going to do that? Everybody should ask, do you think RFK is going to have an influence on those names a health population collapse,

1:22:14 being in this and I can tell you President Trump has kept every promise minds, the damage is done. So his number one use case for AI is to scour the internet and remove any vaccine misinformation from the internet. think the people like Trump's talking about still thinking he's gonna have before everyone in this very important election is do we need more incrementality

1:24:47 They do it so coordinated that you realize same people are still disseminating the news. And more people I think are aware severing that ability, like there's a beautiful force happening right now. I think we all misinformation. And there was none. And this is without Twitter, without X, without Elon Is the First Amendment a major roadblock? stuff you hear about like how much they spend

1:28:07 it was in the lobbying budget. industry, like the food industry, processed foods spends 13 more times more I hear from members of Congress on major committees, You can't be asking for farm fresh eggs farm fresh eggs are down here. Lucky Charms are up here I know I saved it. But there's pings of that consciousness happening, like that's Like it's hard, but but but but I would push back

1:31:28 Like, the media denigrates it, which used to be the number one, and starts naming those agencies and starts saying we're going to get to the bottom of Voters that something isn't quite right He understands it innately. Put someone who's not trying to get their next job at pharma, who's aligned with this fundamental agenda at the NIH, at for the American people?

1:34:14 or trust of those agencies, It's literally an outsourced R&D lab for pharma. Every person listening would expect that the NIH job is to do foundational research. What variables are tied to chronic disease? Executive leadership is existential to this issue. change without strong moral clarity and executive leadership, let me make this super clear. things.

1:37:05 the foundation of Trump's candidacy, in my opinion, which is really taking the corruption out of the There's real visceral political focus on that. these are paper tigers. These are paper tigers. But you need the president to say You have to just ask yourself and this comes from a person who used to be an ever Trumper, Was listening to the list of people, you know, from the industry.

1:39:19 Like, so what is that experience like? and RFK are talking about that's super, super clear. It's like, we are going to get pharma that's what's happening. Scandinavia? Why are we subsidizing the rest of the world and subsidizing the pharmaceutical industrial That's one stroke of a pen. Like, you can do, but it's like literally like just like clear focus.

1:42:14 and all the problems and all the influences and all the stuff that he couldn't correct So if we are able to give voice it's connected to what the top is talking about. I was indoctrinated with that message as a medical student and Kraft Heinz and the USDA forged a deal that's now putting Lunchables in schools that and General Mills, you know, drops because people are no longer willing to buy these

1:45:33 being regenerative agriculture. We're totally screwed if we don't do that. We cannot continue fruit shirt in a very short period of time in America. We believe that's possible. become inspired to do it. They want to be energetic. She wanted to meet her grandchild, but she wasn't able to do. I think there's this slur and this lie. We are a free country.

1:47:54 I never ever learned in medical school or residency Yes. letters of medical necessity. So we've actually been educating members of Congress about this. and depression. So I think where there's all those, overhits the road, and this is an It's nine out of 10 killers of Americans and 95% of medical spending. we've had good conversations. But doctors from Harvard Medical School who are OBGYNs

1:51:18 for Americans to work with their doctor to trust that they don't want to kill themselves. have an HSA and FSA account, max those out. The studies are being kind of shaming those moms, these poor moms on Medicaid, you know, single moms trying to make ends meet. And we have a chapter, don't trust your doctor. over the past 50 years, And so it doesn't really make sense that we would say, oh, they're crushing it on these

1:54:31 utter support, $500 billion program, the farm bill program. they're trying to get it in before Trump gets in on the farm bill. that is, right? We rigged the system beyond recognition, tens of millions of and it's totally against orthodoxy on the conservative side to question any corporation. That's change, which is a very good thing, but you still have little

1:57:17 the health care industry is the lifeblood of every single institution that we trust you know, we kind of need to have almost a spiritual reset here. And that's kind of, I think we can. Like if I didn't think there was a problem with the NIH before COVID. I had no idea that there and his global healthcare initiative, air quotes, that this guy would be so bold as

1:59:30 And it's scary that someone of great influence Yes. It broke something open that I feel like is light, book. And so it was very black and white to me to understand that the financial security and tearful saying, I don't know if I can do this. And especially with cancer, when people are hopeless and desperate and you have something And I think this is actually a lot

2:02:30 that they're, the patient is getting better and they're doing it for a lower cost. That's disease, quality, good outcomes was measured by how many of the patients in that doctor's that's been introduced it's basically giving people the courage in the face of total insanity that happened to agenda, health care thinkers, systems thinkers. bureaucratic you know change and you get to incentive change you get to

2:06:27 Let's give them the information on everything and trust the American people aren't suicidal enough to want to want to kill themselves regenerative ranching and more natural processes and not raping our soil to where there's only can afford this. for their obesity. This is insane. Like going to the pharmacy, having to pay for that, Only legitimate science.

2:09:24 And somehow that's all too, it's too complicated, But like you can get this done in a year. Right. getting going. and there's bipartisan appetite. Again, we've been meeting with dozens of them. I've been It's like 3% in Japan. Like, we're so distracted and by design, right? Like, we're so obsessed Get out of the workforce, rise the corporate ladder.

2:12:45 our priorities and we're giving away our attention freely so that we're so distracted that we're that are trying to capture our attention. You know, you get a kid who's eating the dead food we're feeding our kids and we're doing this because families feel or is killed if it's an animal. Like it starts degrading. That's just what for us to have cells that function properly.

2:15:33 It is a miracle that we are here, that you're here, that I'm alive, that Callie's alive, with ourselves of like getting back to that higher level of like Jesus Christ like we're alive. This because it's big right like believing that this life is a miracle and fighting for it. Well said. I think we It has nothing to do with political party. about money.

2:18:46 Yeah, I'm at KCMeans.com. I have a weekly newsletter that examines all of these things. I'm also the co-founder of a company called Levels, how their diet and their lifestyle root cause metabolic interventions like exercise. We could do that right now with HSAs, FSAs, which is why I started trume.com. with some scripts to talk about this. Thank you.