Joe Rogan Experience #277 — Victor Conte Transcript

Transcript

0:00 The Joe Rogan Experience. correct way to spell it? It was fun? So whether it be go to the Super Bowl with teams or go to world championships or Olympics or whatever it was, And how long did they put you in jail for that? Oh, did he really? It was a sports complex. bocce ball, volleyball, handball. and six ping pong tables. Sounds awesome. Do they test people?

5:06 So it was kind of an honor system. And it was kind of stunning to me. You know how many dudes are trying to go to jail right now? there and my uh cubie was a guy named evil was his name and he said evil i'm gonna have to do They have a real hard time adjusting. a day yeah it gets really weird when it gets to these uh performance enhancing drug trials like

7:56 there all the time and those are legal so because they're legal you say well that's okay well they're we're going to drag you in front of fucking Congress. This is ridiculous. It's called an ICP is the acronym, Can we hear this? Oh, no, it's Rocco who's playing here, the original bass player. I bet you did. tissue, blood, urine, but they mainly used these pieces of equipment.

11:05 I went down to Santa Barbara where the equipment was at that time. I had no background whatsoever, whatsoever. in the Olympics in 1988. And it just continued. The next thing you know, I had professional football players. and we'd centrifuge the blood, separate it into the fluid portion, the plasma or serum, It was when he left the 49ers in 95, and then he went to Philadelphia for a year and had a great season.

13:32 Long story short, they not only won the Super Bowl that year, So 20% of the medals that came back were people that I had been helping. Now, did I know that some of these guys, as an example, in 88, I worked with all the shot putters, hammer throwers, discus throwers. Do they have it timed? this came down and long story short all these eight guys, one at a time, since then have either been

16:05 He was an Olympic official. I mean, this was quite upsetting to him. and decided that it was time to sweep these five positive drug tests that they came up with under the rug. And he said, I don't think it'll cause a positive test. He wouldn't And so the bottom line is that I took some myself But shortly thereafter, with this reduced dosage, They have a list of about 30 to 35 anabolic steroids.

19:38 Now they, if you want me to explain that, I can explain to you why. Now they've removed that second prong. But understand there was two versions of the clear. and I knew somebody that knew him, and long story short, I ended up hiring him. Guys could get this. but I don't know that many within the world of MMA know this, stuff, like a gallon, to Bob Sapp, the K-1 fighter.

23:40 could have played the incredible hulk like he really could have played the Incredible Hulk. Like, he really could have played the Hulk because he was that big. that was just ridiculous. Just think about how much he must have taken to get that big. So anyway, because I had a lot of contacts within the Olympic testing facilities and so on, that they found some, quote, peculiar metabolites in the urine of Marion Jones and other athletes,

25:13 Do the very beginning of the match, because Oh, my God, that guy was big. What is this stuff? i mean my plan didn't work out. would be we'll just subpoena this guy and he can tell what he knows about what everybody's doing way the Balco case ended is I dictated all the terms and conditions of what I would get The VP of Balco got straight probation, so he was able to continue to run my business.

29:10 If you remember when Mark McGuire, they found the Sports Illustrated writer, trend stuff and the third one said new stuff and so you're just giving this to people? Trend stuff. And the third one said new stuff. And so you've just given this to people. So in my mind, I was helping them do what in almost every case they were already doing themselves,

30:46 like i say once i gather this information that everybody's in on it meaning the olympic Wow. Because thereafter, once you cross that line, then we started using all sorts of other things. and he came down for this project, Right. And is that what's going on right now in professional sports? There's not that many of them. yeah but it's like usain bolt and he's got all these gifts but you know my i'm highly suspicious

34:12 and he was the supplier for Trevor Graham and Marion Jones and Tim Montgomery He was the main dealer. I said, oh, my God, that's Memo. athletes So the point is... What testing is Juan Manuel Marquez doing? Well, even that's relatively easy to circumvent. Here's the way it works. But even if they do, the worst scenario is it's like being up to bat in an American baseball game.

37:04 I'm talking about a missed test. Miss's just a strike? They just burn? I don't mean positive. I'm talking about but you still have to test, right? That's strike one. Then, okay, so you're six months out from the Olympics. Otherwise, they suspend your license. What are the girls' names, the big ones? You have to fill these forms out. The first test is at training camp.

39:48 Well, if they're not targeting you and they have no reason to target you, It could be a month. in eight weeks he came in, he weighed 148. What if we had an all-Royd Olympics? Every poll that's ever existed sucks. I'd rather see a guy jump like a mile up in the air than like, you know, seven feet. Really? What the fuck is wrong with you? This is how you get down.

43:33 They won't use drugs, and they don't use drugs. Depends on the sport. And this is during the off-season. And they tried to argue this with me, and I know a lot of Major League Baseball players, They want to promote this propaganda that they're for clean sport. Because the athletes need it in order to play at that level. Effects are much greater on a woman than they are on a man.

46:59 I mean, it's like 12 meters faster. They're competing against these world and Olympic records, Yeah, what are you going to do with the Tour de France? right before balco was raided and i was helping a girl named kelly white and she won was the first Besides ecstasy. Much more powerful. the word out there was that that you know the target, was about 55%.

50:46 Wow, I didn't know that. He'd run about a little quicker than 10 flat. Just go off. They increase your strength. As you know, they're all anabolic androgenic. He followed my advice. So you don't perform your best when you're on steroids. Can you talk into this a little bit better? I cross my fingers. That kid is dynamite. Well, I, Kung Lee. Are people reluctant to work with you?

55:33 are probably some of the cleanest guys out there. Yeah, he played football at Arizona. and experience on him. It's kind of crazy that Kyle is fighting all these really, really It's just correcting weak links or depletions and deficiencies. It doesn't move or it doesn't move? parameters that indicate overtraining. and these guys will go outside the low end of the range at four

58:29 Everybody has a different constitution. And then Friday and Saturday and Sunday. I met him through Romo, but it's something a lot of people have been trained under Mark. And sometimes they even have two people do it on you at the same time. Everybody thinks that it helps to deliver more oxygen molecules to muscle tissue, and it does. correct isn't epo still they don't test for it no no in certain places state commissions don't test

1:01:38 So these guys are getting busted because they're dumb. Yes. He went to a doctor in Las Vegas, So they made a little surgical incision, inserted a pellet. There was no issues. Well, even the highest Olympic standard is 4 to 1. That said, don't be surprised if there's 100 boxers out there that have these pellets in their butt. 800 milligram oh really interesting so now what do you think about testosterone replacement for

1:05:16 We should be able to do this, and so on. But I know when he was suspended it was not when he fought Sylvan in the state of California. Because that's what this doctor told lamont peterson well it's bioidentical it won't cause a positive test you can take this stuff he has no It's coming from outside. So they went to him, based on this intelligence, collected a sample, and it came back his TE ratio was.5 to 1.

1:08:26 With a therapeutic use exemption. You're talking about MMA or boxing and the state commission. Could you? The answer is yes. It's Provigil. That's what Kelly White got tested for? That guy takes Provigil. So it's like a form of kind of like an Adderall? execs are high on this stuff all day long. Provigil. and I really believe him about all those great things,

1:11:43 that have these therapeutic use exemptions for testosterone in Nevada. There's quite a few. There's a lot now or whatever it is mma fighters that have these these therapeutic use exemptions Yeah, that's sort of an unknown factor. I mean, there's all sorts of things that if you wanted to manipulate the system, Exogenous. It may or may not be medically indicated in each one of these cases

1:14:22 and it becomes one of those issues where you're like, okay, And someone needs to say that at a certain point in time. Or maybe there should be a master's category over a certain age. If you do that, I'm not saying that you should never be able to compete anymore, this one out of 500 or one out of 1,000 that may have this level. fucking know there's some of the some of the scorecards that come in, you just go,

1:16:44 It drives me See, in a word, what you just said about all of the above is it's a mess. that's zinc magnesium what else is in there yeah Yeah, it's zinc, magnesium, and vitamin B6 and its specific forms of zinc and magnesium that are very bioavailable. four sleep. The first time that you go into this very deep sleep where your heart rate is The second four hours is when your system produces testosterone. So this is why guys wake up with a

1:19:48 I'm taking that. It's a new liposomal growth hormone replacement. very successful and continues to be very successful. Have you heard of secrotropin? He's the guy that was famous for working with James Toney and a bunch of other athletes. yeah but the way they've uh managed to make the molecule smaller by some sort of a process, I mean, steroid cream?

1:21:41 It's capsule as well. I don't know. Isn't it? Is that why people take cottage cheese at night, too? Jesus Christ. she looks buck wild to me you know i'm saying victor but anyway she got real yoked when she Who is it? because he's like one of those wrestler dudes and through the testing we were able to determine that he was just very dehydrated. And he's like, the only time it's inaccurate is if you're dehydrated.

1:25:28 It has less energy. hyperhydrate, I have Two teaspoons of the salt? a lot of people don't realize this, at about 3,000 parts per million. And of course, the sodium is what causes the retention. Percent water, that's on nature's like, They do that to cut. which is very important for muscle relaxation you know people that drink epsom salt yeah that's only

1:28:59 Like Josh is an example. anybody won. It was such And it was just, he just looked great. and all of a sudden you get dehydrated, and now you've got a three-lane freeway. It's a lot more difficult to deliver and pick up and remove when you're not well hydrated. Isn't that funny? It's pure. at all well i do but a lot of people come to me and you know want me to go to mexico or come to

1:32:05 for the money it's it's uh really about just enjoying being in the trenches with athletes Yes. That word doesn't apply at all to me because at the core of that definition is 24-7-365. when he fought margarito how big was margarito was like 168 in there but in there he was like That's my opinion is yes. Nonito just entered a 24-7 from Japan that he fought the other night.

1:35:37 Do you have something to do with VADA? I met twice with USADA, and it wasn't to give information on anybody. I had three different meetings with them and went over thousands of pages of documents. And it wasn't an exchange for leniency. I got nothing out of it And so I wrote a paper about, you know, how the testing could be set up in a way that would be much more effective,

1:37:22 Dick Pound. He's actually the guy that implemented the very first anabolic steroid testing in the state of Nevada. prohibited substances list. And I'll tell you the interesting aspect and drastic difference between state commissions and WADA and USADA and VADA or anybody that follows the World Anti-Doping Code is the way their system works is everything is illegal unless you get permission from us.

1:39:11 Do you feel like testosterone replacement shouldn't be a part of any sport? It peaks at about four hours in the system aiding with recovery and and tissue repair Will it help you burn body fat? Does it make your muscles stronger and faster? and that is the point of working out your workout your tissue breaks down it gets stronger and it heals quicker if you're on growth

1:41:52 Here's the argument. It doesn't make you stronger You want to know why? Candy flipping. Okay. okay it was about baseball and ryan braun and and the specific test and i got a call from from the and it's a huge loophole, and they should, instead of doing this with growth hormone, No, there's a lot of people that depends on a lot of other factors. I mean, doctors

1:45:11 I've never heard of a human growth hormone exemption Because it makes me think that if you're sticking pellets in your ass I mean, I still don't see gene doping. It's prohibited, and they're attempting to develop a test for it, They'll figure out how genetically modified humans. but over that, it either has to be, it's qualitative. It's an interesting philosophical debate, you know, about what, you know, like I've heard guys say that they would take testosterone and they would take human growth hormone when they get to be 50 years old,

1:48:13 It was really bothering him. So is that fair? I don't think it's a mistake. I was on TRT It's huge. and everybody said, man like strong and she says that's the only time she ever did anything and who the fuck am i to your body just starts losing it like crazy. The research is that at 30 years of age, you begin to decline by about 1% per year. And yet he wants to stick pellets in his ass.

1:52:01 It's one of the least... And if you don't have zinc in your body, you have smaller loads. There's a famous study by Dr. Ohm, and he was trying to figure out why alcoholics develop feminine-like characteristics. Yeah, alcohol is also an immunosuppressant, right? There's no question. and in a period of one year they grew over a foot in height and the size of their sexual organs

1:54:39 How many grams? The absorption is very, very low. Almost every company out there has it. that's how that's how serious brian is about his depletion. That's the healthiest way to do it, zinc? Some people do like oysters. Who the fuck's eating cans? Yeah, because if you get them in a can, man, earlier in the greens. Jesus Christ. and that they're not getting fat

1:57:50 Do you advise fighters on what type of protein they take in their body, benefits to animal protein that you're not No, I think it's important. Well, one thing about red meat that I advise people is cut it up into small pieces. They just like to wolf it. hundreds of times. This kid brings it up. You talked before the show, Brian. This fucking travel from Brazil.

2:00:23 i just got this little sniffle thing going on. If it's not fun, don't do it. Yeah, you got one the moment you walked in, son. Burgers? You got to go on an Asian double date. Yeah, I've got some health issues that I'm dealing with now. difficulty even standing up. We went We made 15 appearances in federal court. you'd want to try some of that shit. I mean, you really felt a significant difference between how you felt?

2:03:22 It was just like you would imagine a SWAT team going after bank robbers. How many people were in there? Absolutely. And then, so we got a call a couple weeks later and said, listen, I told you to get this stuff out of here. And so they ended up writing an article about this in the Burlingame Boutique and Villager, I mean, it was surreal. And like, bam, I don't understand.

2:06:44 and get the number off of it and trace it over the the bay there but we want you to get the aftermath. John Ashcroft, the U.S. Attorney General, Would that fit in a bag? They penned us, yeah. making an example because he's a famous guy because he's the most famous and he will bring even before they took Barry Bonds, No one's heard this aspect. Nowitzki, let me tell you how Balco really started. No one's heard this story.

2:10:54 we won't name him for now, And all of a sudden, I realized that one of the young girls, she was 19 at the time. And he said, dude, you don't know the half of it. He was a San Francisco fireman. bonds and all these elite athletes so for one one year, he came every single Monday night across the freeway. So trophy hunting. when i say and earlier you i said what you had described was a mess yeah this is a mess and

2:14:26 Okay. In other words, she'd used drugs for 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003. They got all the drug calendars. They never went after her at all. Where did you inject it? i've got the video and and the the grand jury transcript but here's here's how they play okay you know, that $350,000 that you made, Let's take it a step forward with Floyd Landis. Wow. corrupt and that i'm saying that it's a mess because both sides are cheating to win.

2:18:22 They will sometimes do what it takes to Hire more cops. Uh, it's still going on. I know he pitched him in like a minor league there in Texas? supposed to be on Showtime, Barry Bonds, the greatest hitter of his generation, Let me put that in context of the statistics. Now, how do they do that? and let's take the B sample and pour it down the drain. because of Roy Jones' loss in the finals against the Korean fighter,

2:22:33 got into the actual drug testing room where Ben Johnson was. that somebody spiked his beer with a stenozolol, a Winstrol tablet. on steroids because it all came out in the dublin inquiry later when when they brought in all the Yes. there so there's always going to be cheap people there. There's always going to be people who cheat. Billy Costello. Not Billy Costello. I took the hide out of a kid's gloves. Billy Costello.

2:24:54 Yeah. is if the people that make the majority of the money from sport whether that be baseball football Is that a legitimate argument or no? But the athletic commissions are not providing that. But, like, EPO is urine. They don't do No, I was like, let me Why do you need to do this test? In a word, I don't care who you are, you get suspicious. They only test for what?

2:28:46 So let's round it off. Do you think that it's like the casino is going to listen? They tell you how to cheat. Implement reasonably effective testing. Look at the home run totals. You do whatever you want, as much as you want, at any time, and nobody's paying attention. she came home from the Olympic Games and retired. But I believe that, you know, I was told three specific names of all gold medalists.

2:31:50 imagine if listen, I sold her all kinds of drugs. Did you hear about what happened today? It was closer. rumor okay that that i heard but it makes a lot of sense. The joke that was going around was that with Floyd Landis, he was the the golden child well they supposedly now are accusing the cycling union um of helping But were there a lot of people in on

2:35:42 And this is when it first came to my attention. Where are they coming from? Her lifetime PR was 1119. All three places. What are they doing? Significantly. All training partners ran times faster than everybody else in the world. Right, Brian? Yak me. It's the mountain yams. Yeah, mountain yams are the shit. And yaks, too. Right, Brian? It seems like it's a big charade, especially it seems like with track and field. I mean, that just seems really kind of like a crazy game.

2:39:40 Wow, fascinating, fascinating shit. And is there a website they can go to to read anything? No, it's S-N-A-C with no K. They do that in my world. You're a very fun and smart guy, and I really enjoyed being here with you. enlightened a lot of people as to how things really work behind the scenes, Tommy Chong, Eat sushi every night. Stop hating. No. And this is going to get really weird.

2:42:23 So I'm going to have him on, and wants to come back, to do it together. It's a I don't know what the fuck a retrovirus is. San Francisco people, we will be He will also be on the show, and me. um and that is uh the more theater in seattle november we gotta stop by uh that podcast studio and also bulletproof coffee, which, by the way, I'm drinking today, ladies and gentlemen.

2:44:50 but I can tell you what the manufactured retail is. Oh, here it is. Try them. It's all cordyceps mushrooms and B12. All right? And I will be back next week. I got to go.