Joe Rogan Experience #844 — Andreas Antonopoulos Transcript

Transcript

0:00 All you creeps that are controlling money all throughout the world, your time is slowly closing in. in order to bring it to the show and give it to you. It literally was printed September 5th. Why don't they just make it one? It was like one out of 12. Yeah, I got it too, so it's on your end. in the world of bitcoin since the last time we spoke we've spoken we we hung out in vegas which

3:08 I look at that a bit as if the Horse Buggy Association of America is going, it is a weird thing to invest in, That would be insane. There's Bitcoin ATMs now, and people are using it to purchase things. dictator too often, and you can earn your money and interact with other people, then why would Yeah, Brazil has had massive devaluation in the last year.

6:13 Massive currency crisis. Currencies don't move like that. Bitcoin climbed 20% that day almost. Really? So did Britain rebound? It did a bit, but it's still in historic lows, multi-decade lows. So they took a really China. So people are parking the money in Bitcoin or using it to convert it to other currencies and And what does it equal right now? So if it's at $616, is that what you said?

9:59 And the little zodiac is bouncing up and down on the waves a lot, right? explain very briefly, if you could, what is Bitcoin and how does it work? It is, as the title of the book says, the internet of money. It is a set of protocols that allow you to basically exchange value with other people. But you can do a lot more with it than just that. And then we would donate it to Fight for the Forgotten.

12:38 They want to tell other people about this technology. and i'll send an invoice and the banking industry conference will send me a They're doing it primarily because the system has a series of intermediaries, protect with that risk by slowing things down. And that risk doesn't exist in Bitcoin don't know, the Bundesbank is the federal bank of Germany. And they probably consider the United

15:50 I said, you do know this is the I'm not trying to receive money from Somalia. with Bitcoin as well I mean wasn't there that issue with those guys that were And how would they do that? Has not happened in seven years. And the way it's structured is impossible to do. In the early days of Bitcoin, there were no exchanges. to create trade cryptocurrencies uh turns out it's a lot easier

19:32 That seems bizarre. it's the guy who robbed the bank, got into 717 aircraft, But also, didn't he drop into the woods? with a satchel full of money. run out the door don't they have like a trace on that money like where they can if you spend out of the left side of my ears i don't know it's a bad cable i have to reset okay no sign of db in 1980 What, he left some of it?

22:35 But I don't know. in those days. That D.B. Cooper story is an interesting hundreds of millions of dollar mystery. or pending trial. whether it was deliberate, he was the top trusted name on Wall Street. And so that's one of the issues with this, something like Mt. because someone in the bank is going to have a tremendous need, all of the oversight system we have in banking, which by the way, fails again and again and again

26:25 And they interviewed the guy who runs it and his reasons for why they're so wildly successful. when there's a recession, when there's a drop in income and profitability for everyone, is a recession, the Fed steps in, or the government steps in. And basically, they pump water to raise You need a cleansing event to wash out the fraud. More stimulus, more funding, the Federal Reserve pumps more money into the economy,

30:29 Deal yes the issue that you know you're talking about how they stop forest fires But in order to create an organization like that, drains the which drains the swamp raise rates. Basically, the interest rate controls the cost of money. because it benefits savers instead of debtors. So if you and you get home, you have hobbies and family and things that you want to do,

33:36 not talking about Bitcoin I'm talking about 22 central banks simultaneously taking their interest What does that mean, though? Well, it's so confusing for anyone as it is when you get into the issue of what is money It used to be gold. But one of the things is he carried a gun everywhere he went, He had silver coins. freak. It's like a weird control freak. You know, if someone's saying something to you and they are

36:51 But this guy used to carry these coins around with him. minted in the u.s full silver coins you can buy them right now they're weird as fuck they're weird And here's the thing. Right? your parents tell you the stories and carry your entire Bitcoin wallet Party on? even if it has millions and billions of transactions and assets in it. You don't pick the words.

40:08 But think about the power of being able to transport an unlimited amount of money simply by memorizing 12 words that can't be confiscated from you when you're a refugee. When I look at the landscape of money, is incredibly corrupt and Okay. money without anybody noticing. hundreds and hundreds of crooks in the same states in this country for six job. And, you know, coming into a generation where their parents could get by with one income in a

44:19 There are some places that have it better financially. But it really is quite an incredible concept to be able People are uncomfortable with Bitcoin because it represents changing one of the fundamental ancient technologies of civilization, money. I have a deposit of gold there. You go to someone who's been using precious metals for How long is that transition?

46:58 But it's been almost 10. just like many places they are. If you're operating between the border of Kenya and Tanzania, for example, Because they trade for their parents things, music, video, things like that, where you want to make very, very small payments The possibility of doing things that are so far outside time, and you're paying a fraction that is a thousandth of a penny. And you keep watching

50:03 Unless you're Apple and you're doing billions, in which case you can take it down to 99 cents. a penny or half a penny or a tenth of a penny to watch a video but what how would that work for the uh i'm not good at doing improv math seven grand no it's like 70 bucks 70 dollars But I get this content for free right now, Andreas. If the product costs less than two or three dollars...

52:18 what they're doing is they're selling your data to advertisers. You're paying by the fact that you can no longer engage with the web Yeah, but you're cutting out advertising? So you've got to think about it. No, no problem. It's a lot of hype. But the point is that you can do more than just currency. and decide who is and who isn't a troll and censor them,

55:58 anything serious but if they try to comment they have to spend a bit of that credit that they've earned that reputation that they've earned. it suddenly starts getting interesting because now it gets expensive to steal Because if you go to a But you've got to think about this again know you can actually balance these things out well if you go to a flat earth forum and argue

57:41 In this conversation. Otherwise I don't survive the flight. and they're used to measure the velocity of the aircraft through the air frustrating you can present mountains of evidence if someone really really doesn't want to believe they they really will not believe well there's also um i mean And it's usually on hazy days. And so by pushing a thing through the air, you're pressing on the air.

1:00:46 I didn't. And then you talk to people. but it says sludge like the laboratory that you sent this stuff to says sludge and he and well about like a piss-poor cost ineffective shitbag program that does absolutely I mean, it's the dumbest fucking thing. Something like that. People are wiping the Cheetos off their greasy little fat fucking fingers right now and hammering at the keyboards, ready to call us shills.

1:03:52 You're seeing it all the time. is a shill. He's a shill. Just look at him sweating. and if you leave, he gets half the principal. Oh, Jesus Christ. What is that? throw around a lot but here's the interesting thing is why do these schemes happen right You should get involved. Whoa. out and they push these things as investments and you can have a lot of volatility.

1:07:10 Yes. And what's really fucked up about it is that they're doing it with algorithms and they're gambling and they're buying and selling within like a fraction of a second. There's a data center there where probably the largest amount of money moves ever. And they buy and sell and buy and sell and buy and sell and do all of this within fractions of a second.

1:09:45 During this time, they've actually made more money. To a person on the outside looking at that and trying to figure out what the fuck those people are doing. Yeah. and you create this hybrid technology, And it is a completely borderless, multinational, open and peer-to-peer, open source software merchant system running on top of bitcoin No fees, no restrictions.

1:12:39 I have to download the program, so I'm going to find another way to look at it. and because all of the listings are in a peer-to-peer from t-shirts to... A lot of these dorks are going to flip phones now. No. It doesn't ring, ever. They're selling CBD oil It's funny. I'm running a bunch of things. Yes, I am on my phone. It's not a lease. It's fundamental freedom, and we're gradually losing it.

1:17:01 have you ever messed with that, the Samsung Galaxy S7? Yeah. It's probably something like that. Yeah. Well, no, not really. Because from what I can tell, really, laptops are gradually disappearing. and gradually diminishing the importance of laptops But if I need to work, if I need to get some stuff done, I want a laptop. in particular yeah oh do you think the great american novel is being written by thumbs

1:20:33 There were no others. and then I convert it into dollars to pay for things that I can't pay in Bitcoin. and 98% into my checking account. How would it cause you a big problem if someone sees something? And basically it operates, one of the exchanges in the U.S. offers this. Did they look at you sideways? And so I make a payment All the time. My bank can't. They simply can't. They want me 24 hours before I leave to call them and give them a

1:24:25 If I need to move more money into it, if I need to take money cash out of an ATM when I'm traveling, Yeah, I get excited about these things. They have to do all of the Patriot Act, Bank Secrecy Act, Show Me ID, proof of residence, etc., etc., both offer Visa debit cards. So that's one side. They want to use it within the banking system, tried to kick them off and not give them DSL networks at the time.

1:27:37 So they wouldn't let the internet be on the phone network. because they would disrupt the Wow. And in those early days, And we've seen that with, Yeah. Yes. Oh, 900 of them that suck. borders, with controlled access, permissioned access, as they would call it, and that by ask permission to create a new application. And any application you write will instantaneously

1:31:57 you could connect to that weren't part of the internet. And then after that, corporate intranets. exactly be what would happen with money if local banks or national banks. Yes. So to follow from is that you have to use the national currency over the economy, and the banks being the ones who sort of enforce the kind of laws that have allowed the mortgage crises and allowed these bubbles to

1:35:08 And there are some countries that are completely cashless. a significant percentage of the GDP. Credit, debit, mobile pay. by SMS. And they started using It is kind of shocking, but here's the problem. It's no longer yours anymore. It's frozen. It's seized. It's gone. And someone has control of tipping is pretty much the last remaining part of our society

1:38:47 that every single payment in your life will be from you to a corporation. or Bitcoin or whatever. where instead of having separation of state and money, because I'm fully aware of what the other future is, and it's already playing out. And what is the resistance that Bitcoin is facing And what happens then is what I call the five stages of grief. It will never survive.

1:42:29 which kind of undermines It's going to die. Pedophiles. the internet right the the internet when it first came out they you you heard this media narrative they can get their hands on money launderers of drugs in the world are hsbc the hong kong hong kong shanghai banking consortium So there are inconvenient facts like that. So you don't talk about these in polite company, or at least you do.

1:46:03 No, we moved on to talk about more realistic and very positive towards cryptocurrencies in general. It's very difficult to say. Primarily because there's no clear association between one person and one Bitcoin address or account. There Based on activity levels, globally oh globally yeah globally globally maybe two to four million people you said most of them

1:48:38 easy to use. And so right now, it's not easy to use. It's not ready for mouse adoption. things that you can't do with credit cards. or to accelerate this? We just have to wait and be patient until it happens what could be like the steps that could be taken to Right? working and then eventually i sent an email and then it took a couple of days to cross the internet right and then almost exactly 20 years later my mom went swipe and did the same thing on her ipad so when you take you know two days of compiling software writing complex unix commands sending

1:51:57 But mail did. Yeah. The level at which you need to have technology for someone to adopt Bitcoin and immediately become, upon and people wrote books about this is the fact that in many places in africa landlines were never people's phones and hold them at gunpoint and just steal all their Bitcoin? Yeah. But you might. are familiar with can we see that yeah so this is called a bitcoin trezor it looks like one of

1:55:55 Does that feel weird? I have a second one. because it can coexist on all of them, I could. No. Here's the thing. And it's great because what they do is that way they find these, they have professional hackers really who go in and break the software. at the end of it. Which is why And the reason it remains secure is not magical. It's about I can take this and I can plug it in to the, you know, those desktops they have in hotel lobbies where you can print your boarding pass.

1:59:32 trying to get to your device. a very, very narrow, Is it impossible to integrate a virus that you could read. Yeah. I keep The point of this device is that you can secure your Bitcoin, my mom can secure her Bitcoin, It's from a cartoon by Randall Munroe on XKCD. So you can put a small amount of Bitcoin in a specific account Listen, when I go to a country where security isn't as good, right? I carry my cash

2:03:27 That's why robbers are aware of it. They are that. I was looking through some of my files. a sophomore in college Those were like $2,000, right? With that strapped to my side Well when you do, please send it my way Teenager, college. Yeah, exactly. All I do is read about what is new in Bitcoin, and that's a full time job. How many people are there like you?

2:06:16 Who are doing this, yeah. Maybe you should talk to the other 199. These devices will seem antiquated. because then they're compromised. So we've progressed. But, it's still not ready. So, the bottom line is that five years from now, but they're able to do it with security in a way that doesn't No, no, no, no. where they're trying to See, that's what I said.

2:09:56 I'd be around for a bit in the lunchroom the other week. The one that's becoming really big now. Allison will be in the studio shortly. What does it mean? And it's getting bigger and bigger all the time. when the internet was just so completely impossible to understand i feel very All right. three thousand dollars a month in insurance to It's entirely possible.

2:13:34 It was a proof of war algorithm backed by oil. I think it's going to be amazing And it's fascinating. really didn't exist before and now exist almost primarily i mean i think um it's it's absolutely We're living in a different world. and we're very lucky to be part of a generation where we have advancements in technology happening at a rate where you don't just see one or two,

2:16:27 It happened with credit cards. It gets less cumbersome to use. Ah, that fucking one. have any pictures in it what's up with that it does not have any pictures in it um i have a I'll put it in the info on YouTube.